towing rig

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mrcantrell

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tim
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Hello Im new here and im looking on some input i have a 1987 c30 crewcab only 55,000 on her she's still like new. Im looking into getting into hotshoting 30ft goose neck ..can she do it ? i have a 6.5 turbo diesel im willing to build out to swap in her.

spects: c30 crewcab
454 tbi with turbo 400
4.11 gears
all stock

Im willing to do upgrades this is my dream truck and i will not be selling it ever so i dont care how much i put into her...all though i would like to stay cheap as possible till i get my foot in the door.

DO YOU GUYS THINK SHE CAN DO IT?
 

Big Chip

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I'm dubious, you'll be perpetually overweight. I don't think the 6.5 would be an improvement either.
 

mrcantrell

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I'm dubious, you'll be perpetually overweight. I don't think the 6.5 would be an improvement either.
I know its pretty heavy im open to ideas for the trailer i just want to do some non cdl...and the 6.5 i can build out to around 350hp and over 600tq. do you think a 6bt would be better? im a 6.5 guy all the way i love them.
 

Big Chip

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SirRobyn0

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@mrcantrell What Kevin said is right on. Look I'm a farmer, and I'll admit to running over weight now and then. You can't do that and make a business out of it. For one thing it's a terrible liability your part and any company that allows you to haul for them. The 6.5 is also not a good idea IMO, just the weight alone. So you'd be into it for the motor, a tranny a rear end, and completely new possibly with custom fabricated front end parts, to find out no one will hirer you to run over weight.

I would love to see pictures of your truck and hope you keep it as is and enjoy it as a personal vehicle.
 

Redfish

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"Can she do it" is one question but the real question is "should she do it". I say it's a bad idea.

Hotshotting is about reliably moving things from place to place as efficiently as possible. Squarebody Trucks are not aerodynamically efficient.
If you can build a 6.5 to those HP and Torque numbers I would worry about the long term reliability required for a hot shot vehicle.
Long hours and miles in the seat will be a LOT easier in a more comfortable, more modern vehicle.
If you are not legally able to tow the weight your job opportunities will be severely reduced.

I say fix up your Dream Truck however you like but buy something newer that is more comfortable, more efficient and is rated for the work you wish to do. Folks may think you look cool with that old truck but they will wonder about the reliability. That will affect the success of your business.

You must be registered for see images attach


I really enjoy my '87 Square Body but for long miles and heavy loads my '07 LBZ Duramax was a lot more comfortable and more efficient.

My '19 Duramax got better fuel mileage pulling my '87 on a trailer than the '87 could get running by itself.

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Bextreme04

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I've never actually seen a GCWR listed on any of our trucks... its not in the heritage pamphlet. The crew cab trucks have a MUCH stronger frame and with that 454/TH400/4.10 combo, you likely have the 10,000lb GVWR and the truck should have a rated payload of 3-4k lbs. This means that the truck is definitely rated to have a gooseneck that size on it. The bad part is going to come with your trailer weight and the rated towing capacity, which might be hard to find. I think I have seen 10k lbs towing capacity listed somewhere for a crew-cab. That means you might have a 20k lb GCWR... maybe. I would say you might be OK if you can get the 6.5 built well and back it with a 4L85 or NV4500. We had turbo 6.5's and 4L80's in the newer up-armored HMMWV's and those things were up in the 16,000lb range for weight with all the added armor and they still had some good pep in them.
 

oldretiredafguy

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Tim,
2 Questions for you: 1. Is your K30 SRW or DRW? 2. How many axles on the 30' GN, and or the GVWR of the trailer?
 
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oldretiredafguy

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Tim,
Let me throw some numbers at you for your consideration. I just received a 1989 GM Trailering guide, to use as a guide for the restoration of my 1991 Suburban V-1500.

I'm going to assume the '89 figures for trucks would be the same (or in the ballpark) for your 1987 K30. I have been heavy hauling commercial and private owned trailers (mine) for 35 years. Former CDL with a doubles and triples endorsement (also tanker, passenger, and hazmat, but those don't matter in this discussion).


1989 K(V) 30 is rated for 10,000 GVWR with DRW, and a max trailer weight of 10,000 with 4.10 gearing (13,000 with 4.56 gears (a lot less for both figures for a SRW). The CGWR (Combined Gross Weight Rating) is 16,000 with 4:10 gearing (19,000 with 4.56 gearing). How the numbers work is you take your vehicle curb weight of 5441 lbs, add 150 lb per person, plus any extra items like tools and tiedown chains and strapping, lets say 500 lbs. Total 6,091 plus weight of the cargo trailer. I used to own a GN 40' deck triple axle car/hay hauler. The empty weight was 5050. So just for an example we'll use that in our calculations. 6091+5050=11,141 lbs. Subtract this from your CGWR of 16,000-11,141=4,859 (19,000-11,1141=7,859) payload capability. Not much when you consider a load of drill stem pipe for oil/gas applications can be 10-15,000 lbs. Or a genset or motor for a drill rig can be 10,000-12,000 lbs. The figures for a 6.2 diesel are a lot less than the 454 gasser. Of course, boatloads of folks exceed the CGWR on a daily basis with the current crop of diesel trucks. The lucky thing is that for most folks who exceed this CGWR is this figure is the truck manufacturers recommendation. The hard (legal) numbers are the GVWR's for tow vehicle plus load.


Now, lets look at your 30' GN cargo trailer. If it has dual tandem axles, they are generally rated at 10,000-12,000 per axle. If the trailer is single wheel axles, probably 7,000 axles (maybe 8,000's) x2. If dual tandems, the trailer is rated for 24,000 GVWR. Add the GVWR of The K(V) 30 (10,000 lbs) and the GVWR goes up to 34,000. Max rating for a combo rig without a CDL is 26,000. Go up to 26,001 and you are now in the mandatory CDL weight range. I still own and operate an Oversized Load Pilot Car company, and routinely go thru multiple scale houses in different states. Let me be emphatic in saying these folks have no sense of humor regarding overweight violations. They will issue you a large fine ticket, impound your rig on the spot, and require you to find a CDL driver to move it. Yes, you can always leave the trailer and take your truck, but you're leaving a valuable trailer, and more importantly your customers load unattended. Not a way to instill confidence in your company.


Now let's cut to the bottom line. I have never seen a hot-shot company operate without a DOT number. This requires a CDL driver, commercial insurance, and your own operating authority. The big thing in successful hot-shot operations is repeat business and word of mouth recognition. Another thing most shippers will ask for is your DOT number and insurance policy. Don't have them=no load consignment


To answer your question, your truck may be able to do it, assuming your trailer is light enough to stay under the CDL umbrella. But how many jobs will you get with a 5-8K payload capacity? Should you do it? Only the guy in your bathroom mirror can answer that.

IMHO, go get your CDL. It's not a tough test, and will open many doors if you're interested in that industry.

(Edited to amplify/correct some points/figures).
 
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1979 c20

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Commercial driving has certain baseline expectations to keep the DOT & insurance folks from weighing your wallet. Try and sidestep things and when you get nailed it will be hard to recover.

If you want to make a small fortune in trucking, start with a large fortune. It isn't Shipping Wars.
 

Frankenchevy

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Either way, a built 6.5 can’t hold a candle to a mild 6bt. Simplicity, reliability, potential; a 12v is unmatched for light truck diesel applications.
 

Grit dog

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Either way, a built 6.5 can’t hold a candle to a mild 6bt. Simplicity, reliability, potential; a 12v is unmatched for light truck diesel applications.
^This. It’s not even a contest. And I wouldn’t wish a 6.5 even on someone I didn’t like…
That aside, attempting to hot shot with an antique (yes they’re antiques now) truck is either an act of futility or you better know how to build and fix vehicles early and often. IMO.
Not to mention the other requirements and costs.
 

Itali83

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I’m going to play devils advocate here. I know nothing about the laws and weights of hot shotting as a disclaimer. But I am a advocate for running old iron instead of modern or new. I’m a heavy duty truck mechanic and also have my class A commercial driving license. I have my own tractor trailer truck. It’s a 1987 Autocar with a fully mechanical Caterpillar 3406b motor. I ran it all around New England for 3 years on the side while turning wrenches too.

The key to running old iron is having upfront cash to buy said truck, and COMPLETELY, did you read that? COMPLETELY go through it. Motor, transmission, rear ends, hoses, wiring, brakes, u-joints, axle seals, belts. The WHOLE 9 yards. With todays garbage for vehicles from cars to class 8 trucks, I would go get groceries in a new vehicle let alone rely on one to make a living.

I don’t understand the thought that back in the 70’s and 80’s no one hauled anything or worked these trucks at all. Yes, they don’t ride like a new truck, may be louder, etc, but you’ll be the one waving when you pass them because one sensor took a dump or heaven forbid you have emission issues.

I would pass broken down trucks all the time with my antique and kept on making money. The key is spending money upfront. Get the truck mint or better. You may spend 20-30 grand going through a square body to set it up right. How much is a new or newer one. Double that easily, and it’ll still need work to be reliable.

Here’s my truck. My father and I took 8 years restoring it and lost count of money, but a new daycab truck equivalent to this is pushing $175k easily. And I ain’t got that in this by a long shot.

Ben
 

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AuroraGirl

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I've never actually seen a GCWR listed on any of our trucks... its not in the heritage pamphlet. The crew cab trucks have a MUCH stronger frame and with that 454/TH400/4.10 combo, you likely have the 10,000lb GVWR and the truck should have a rated payload of 3-4k lbs. This means that the truck is definitely rated to have a gooseneck that size on it. The bad part is going to come with your trailer weight and the rated towing capacity, which might be hard to find. I think I have seen 10k lbs towing capacity listed somewhere for a crew-cab. That means you might have a 20k lb GCWR... maybe. I would say you might be OK if you can get the 6.5 built well and back it with a 4L85 or NV4500. We had turbo 6.5's and 4L80's in the newer up-armored HMMWV's and those things were up in the 16,000lb range for weight with all the added armor and they still had some good pep in them.
I think 12k on certain equipped 88-91 chassiss like suburban and commercial (or just chassis?) when the gmt 400 was also being sold for that short time under the same setup, the square had the higher rating till gmt went full time.
 

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