Just won't seem to fire.

[LYTEMUP]

I have an 86 C10 with a 305 (installed in 2004). The truck is in overall pretty good shape. I instilled a 1406 Edelbrock carb, new Taylor wires, plugs and a little dress up. The truck has a newer distributor and a good battery. I was having problems with the truck just turning over and not getting any fire. You can tell it is getting fuel because you can smell it. The other day it would not start at all. The truck just turns over and thats it. I checked for power to the distributor and it was good. I had the ignition module tested and ended up buying a new one from O'Reilly's. It fired right up and ran for a day. The next day it did it again. I tested the module again and it was fine. Replaced the rotor and it fired right up. I did notice that the little "button" in the top of the distributor cap did not actu like it had a spring to it. I took it apart and it was in there. Cleaned a little bit of slag off the "button" in the distributor, installed the rotor and it fired right up. Drove it for a few days. got in it this morning to go to work, it started up, started choking and sputtering then died. Will just turn over now, no fire.
I am wondering if it is a bad pick up coil? I think the electronic spark has already been bypassed. I have a 5 wire module. Can I buy one of those complete 50K distributors on Ebay that everyone is talking about? I hear for being cheep they actually work great. I was just wondering because alot of aftermarket distributors do not have a 4 wire harness plugging into the bottom of the cap next to the 1 power wire harness. Advise please? Thank you.

 

[crazy4offroad]

Have you had the coil tested? If it passes then I would assume the pickup coil. As far as the aftermarket 1-wire distributor, I'm not sure what all systems are affected by bypassing the ESC box, temperature overheat shutdown maybe, oil pressure drop shutdown, things like that.

 

[LYTEMUP]

Well I looked up alot of info on the distributors from Ebay and they are not fairing too well. Alot of + or - 5* in timing jumping all over the place. I will just have to try an MSD or Accel. I will do just that and get my coil tested out.
I am pretty sure my ESC is bypassed already. I don't know much about how these are set up but the guy at the local O'Reilly's said it sounded like mine was already by passed and switched over. I am way too used to TFI ignitions that this is kinda throwing me for a loop.
Can I just do a standard ignition box with a separate coil and a smaller distributor cap?

 

[Jims86]

Well I looked up alot of info on the distributors from Ebay and they are not fairing too well. Alot of + or - 5* in timing jumping all over the place. I will just have to try an MSD or Accel. I will do just that and get my coil tested out.
I am pretty sure my ESC is bypassed already. I don't know much about how these are set up but the guy at the local O'Reilly's said it sounded like mine was already by passed and switched over. I am way too used to TFI ignitions that this is kinda throwing me for a loop.
Can I just do a standard ignition box with a separate coil and a smaller distributor cap?

First, have your coil tested like C4 said, and yes, it could be the pickup, common culprit.
As a general,rule, I stay away from aftermarket stuff if I can, but see if you can get a AC Delco reman dist from rock auto. All AC Delco for ignition= better reliability. Check all your grounds before spending any money, especially in the dist, and wher it bolts to the manifold

 

[LYTEMUP]

Had my coil tested and compared the results with a new one. We checked ohms and the old one would put out a reading and then read nothing when you wiggled the red wire. The new one gave a good reading no matter what you wiggled. I installed the new one but did not install the center ground hook that plugs into the harness since there was already one in it. I cannot figure out how it grounds when there is nothing metal. Anyway I installed the new coil and nothing...

 

[Kapdin]

had the same problem bud, turned out pickup coil. Bought a drop in dizzy from summit, been going strong for 4 months now not a single hickup.

 

[Jims86]

Had my coil tested and compared the results with a new one. We checked ohms and the old one would put out a reading and then read nothing when you wiggled the red wire. The new one gave a good reading no matter what you wiggled. I installed the new one but did not install the center ground hook that plugs into the harness since there was already one in it. I cannot figure out how it grounds when there is nothing metal. Anyway I installed the new coil and nothing...

sorry if this has been mentioned befor, but have you checked for power at the pink wire in a no start/run condition?

 

[LYTEMUP]

had the same problem bud, turned out pickup coil. Bought a drop in dizzy from summit, been going strong for 4 months now not a single hickup.

Yep I am afraid that is going to be the way I am headed. My PIP went out in my 94 GT and it did the same thing. Dropped in a new distributor and away I went.

Jims86---I did check the power with the ignition in the on position. I only tested it with a light, but it was a very bright strong light.

I am thinking I should change the little ground strap in the distributor that came with the new coil.

 

[82chevy350]

You can get a nice accel distributor fairly cheap maybe even get a nice super coil while your at it. Jegs has them and ive had very good results with the accel distributor!

 

[LYTEMUP]

You can get a nice accel distributor fairly cheap maybe even get a nice super coil while your at it. Jegs has them and ive had very good results with the accel distributor!

I bought a new coil and it didn't take care of anything. I have only one thing left to change and I am just going to replace the distributor and not the pick up coil. I just have to find some time to free up and do it.

VanBuren Arkansas huh? My Gma was a "Pointer" from VanBuren

 

[LYTEMUP]

Update:
We stuck another distributor in it this afternoon. It was out of an older truck because it didn't have the harness that comes in the back side against the fire wall. It also has a 4 pin module.
We checked TDC, rotor location and even pulled the valve cover off to watch the valves. Dumped a little fuel in the carb and it choked and sputtered, but would not start. Pulled #1 plug and we do have fire. Just won't start. Noticed that the fuel filter had a tad bit of fuel in it, but was not gaining any as we tried to start the truck. My battery is low so I have it on the charger.
First off I noticed a ground wire just hanging loose. This ground comes out of the firewall on the passenger side just above the valve cover. There are a few more wires coming out with it, but this ground was not hooked up. Anyone know what that ground is for? I am thinking it was coming out of the same location that the harness that plugs into the back of the distributor is.
Second, I am wondering if my fuel pump has been the problem all along. I smelt fuel, noticed the filter was half full, but just assumed it was getting fuel. Now there is hardly anything in there and once it burnt off what we dumped in all it would do was turn over.
I am very confused...

 

[chengny]

What does your spark look like?

This is a basic test but can tell you a lot. Pull a plug wire off any convenient plug and stick a screwdriver in the boot. Hold the shank of the screwdriver close (1/4" is good) to the engine block and have an assistant crank the starter.

Note the condition of the spark. It should easily jump from the screwdriver to the engine, be a bright blue arc with and emit an audible "snap" sound.

If it is a feeble yellow trickle and makes no sound the problem is with the ignition system - forget about the fuel system.

Also watch closely when the assistant releases the key from start to the run position - does the spark suddenly become more intense? It may take several crank ups and releases before you get lucky and see what the spark looks like when the starter is released.

My point is this- if the spark improves dramatically when the starter circuit is no longer drawing power fron the battery, that could be the problem. If the starter motor or the solenoid are shorted internally it can cause your overall system voltage to drop below 10.5 volts. That is the minumum required by the primary to produce the high voltage required in the secondary.

Check primary voltage at the pink wire with a meter while cranking. Don't go by static condtions (i.e just with the key in the run position), the starter has to be drawing power for a true test.

Without at least 10 volts at the pink wire during crank, you wont get a spark out of the coil that is strong enough to fire the fuel/air mixture.

Is this the ground wire you are wondering about?

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That is the cab body to engine ground strap - it's not part of the ignition system. Along with the cab mounting bolts, it's funcion is to provide a path to ground (the negative terminal of the battery) for cab mounted electrical components.

When you get a chance, you should make it up - there is a bolt hole in the back of the RH cylinder head that it is commonly connected to. But that won't help your spark, probably half of the old trucks out on the road today don't have one - and they still fire up fine.

 

[LYTEMUP]

Well here is an update on the old truck. I don't wanna have one of those posts that is just up in the air.
We swapped out the ESC distributor and just installed a four prong module distributor and didn't hook up the ESC wiring. After replacing the fuel pump we got it to run. Fiddled around with the timing but still have some kinks to work out. It is pretty shaky, backfires and pops a little, but all in all it just needs some fine tuning. Thanks for all the input, I really appreciate it.

 

[LYTEMUP]

Final update post. The truck is up and running good today. After changing coil, distributor, rotor, cap, battery and throwing on a last minute fuel pump the job is done. Fixed the shaky idle and backfire with about 14* timing and a new distributor cap. Runs like a champion turtle. Thanks again everyone for the advise and help.