Regulator rollers

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mavtricks71

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Hey just wondering if anybody knows why some of my rollers are tight and some loose ..... Wondering if it even matters. Thanks mike

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da_raabi

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I think its normal. Mine were the same way, new and old, power and manual. One would think it would make more sense for them all to roll but... nobody asked me. I just greased the living piss out of them and called it good!

I'd love to know why they are like that though.
 

mavtricks71

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Yea ...I do know the rollers are kinda like ball joints ....when window goes up and down the regulator moves sorta in and out ...and rollers make up for that movement.....and they slide as well in the slides.....but still makes me wonder if they were all tight when the regulator was brand new.
 

74 Shortbed

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The one door I replaced the motor in had one loose and two tight, and I couldn't get them to loosen up no matter how much I lubed them, but with the tracks greased up and ****, window goes up and down real smooth no binding at all..
 

mavtricks71

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The one door I replaced the motor in had one loose and two tight, and I couldn't get them to loosen up no matter how much I lubed them, but with the tracks greased up and ****, window goes up and down real smooth no binding at all..
Yea who the heck knows what the deal is...ill lube mine too and just put it back in the door.
 

chengny

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You know, I looked at this topic a few years ago - for two reasons.


First, I was lucky enough to get my hands on a pair of NOS/NIB power window regulators for a PW/PL conversion I was doing. When I first looked at them, I was surprised to find that some of the rollers were essentially locked. It was awhile ago, so I can't remember if just one locked or just two. You could rotate it/them with a pair of Channelocks and a little bit of effort. But, I didn't want to FU a brand new pair of OEM regulators by cranking on the rollers - that weren't actually supposed to rotate on their pins.

Second, it made more sense to me that they were apparently designed to slide along - rather than actually roll - in the tracks. If you think about it, how much rotational force is actually imparted to a nylon roller that is applying a mainly upward/downward pressure - on the intentionally greased horizontal surfaces of the tracks.


I did a lot of research on the subject - or tried to anyway. Apparently, there isn't a lot of interest/info in this issue. But in the end, what little I did find lead me to believe that the term "roller" is a misnomer. A more accurate description might have been "slider".


There are really just two problems that can develop with these nylon pieces. For the sake of argument, let's just call them "wheels":


1. Flat spots on the OD’s of the wheels - this is blamed on the wheel hubs being unable to rotate on their pins (and one area getting worn down by abrasion after years of sliding along in the tracks).


2. Excessive play/increased clearance between the pin and wheel hub - this is blamed on years of rolling and the pressure created by lifting the glass (IOW, just normal wear & tear).


And here is the most frequent complaint associated with each of the two types of wheel problem.


1. The locked wheel/flat spot complaint: the window doesn't go all the way up. The conventional wisdom here is that as the depth of the flat spot increases, the distance between its pin and the upper surface of the wheel is decreased. That, in turn decreases the total vertical rise of the window. Eventually, it gets so worn - that when you close the window - the glass doesn't seal tightly up against the top edge of the run and you get an annoying whistle on the highway.


Sounds reasonable right? Until you realize - that even when the window is all the way up - there are still a few teeth left on the regulator's driven quadrant gear that don't get used by the pinion (hand crank or drive motor). There is way more than enough to compensate for any minor lost motion due to a flat spot.


2. The wobbly wheel complaint: This probably doesn't even warrant a description - we've probably all seen what loose rollers can do. Over time, they can get so loose on their pins that rolling the window up can become a real PITA.

The glass gets cocked in channel runs and jams – usually on the way up. If it is a manually operated regulator, the hand crank splines can get stripped - then you have to use Vise-grips. With PW’s, the motors often can't lift the glass. And even if they can lift it - they do it real slow. The motors fail prematurely. In the worst cases, the glass can fall right out of the runs.



I decided to leave my rollers tight on the pins - just like I found them out of the box. I never did find out how they were holding up because I only had the truck for about a year after installing them.
 
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74 Shortbed

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All good points, I think the key is keeping everything clean and well lubricated and things should last a long time, it's not like it's lifting a 100lbs or anything, lol..
 

mavtricks71

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You know, I looked at this topic a few years ago - for two reasons.


First, I was lucky enough to get my hands on a pair of NOS/NIB power window regulators for a PW/PL conversion I was doing. When I first looked at them, I was surprised to find that some of the rollers were essentially locked. It was awhile ago, so I can't remember if just one locked or just two. You could rotate it/them with a pair of Channelocks and a little bit of effort. But, I didn't want to FU a brand new pair of OEM regulators by cranking on the rollers - that weren't actually supposed to rotate on their pins.

Second, it made more sense to me that they were apparently designed to slide along - rather than actually roll - in the tracks. If you think about it, how much rotational force is actually imparted to a nylon roller that is applying a mainly upward/downward pressure - on the intentionally greased horizontal surfaces of the tracks.


I did a lot of research on the subject - or tried to anyway. Apparently, there isn't a lot of interest/info in this issue. But in the end, what little I did find lead me to believe that the term "roller" is a misnomer. A more accurate description might have been "slider".


There are really just two problems that can develop with these nylon pieces. For the sake of argument, let's just call them "wheels":


1. Flat spots on the OD’s of the wheels - this is blamed on the wheel hubs being unable to rotate on their pins (and one area getting worn down by abrasion after years of sliding along in the tracks).


2. Excessive play/increased clearance between the pin and wheel hub - this is blamed on years of rolling and the pressure created by lifting the glass (IOW, just normal wear & tear).


And here is the most frequent complaint associated with each of the two types of wheel problem.


1. The locked wheel/flat spot complaint: the window doesn't go all the way up. The conventional wisdom here is that as the depth of the flat spot increases, the distance between its pin and the upper surface of the wheel is decreased. That, in turn decreases the total vertical rise of the window. Eventually, it gets so worn - that when you close the window - the glass doesn't seal tightly up against the top edge of the run and you get an annoying whistle on the highway.


Sounds reasonable right? Until you realize - that even when the window is all the way up - there are still a few teeth left on the regulator's driven quadrant gear that don't get used by the pinion (hand crank or drive motor). There is way more than enough to compensate for any minor lost motion due to a flat spot.


2. The wobbly wheel complaint: This probably doesn't even warrant a description - we've probably all seen what loose rollers can do. Over time, they can get so loose on their pins that rolling the window up can become a real PITA.

The glass gets cocked in channel runs and jams – usually on the way up. If it is a manually operated regulator, the hand crank splines can get stripped - then you have to use Vise-grips. With PW’s, the motors often can't lift the glass. And even if they can lift it - they do it real slow. The motors fail prematurely. In the worst cases, the glass can fall right out of the runs.



I decided to leave my rollers tight on the pins - just like I found them out of the box. I never did find out how they were holding up because I only had the truck for about a year after installing them.
I completely agree with all of this....rollers arnt meant to roll they just slide in the tracks ...and they pivot like a ball joint as window goes up and down.....Also makes sense if rollers are loose the window can be crooked.....all points make sense ....as long as my window is going up and down ok with no nasty noise or crooked.....im calling it good.
 

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