80 C10 "Nemo" Build - Started as: Front frame buckled…

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Trucksareforwork

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Ton of progress today but not many pictures.

Got the motor masked and painted, and installed the intake, plugs, and balancer. Went with black. I’m a Chevy orange fan but decided to go black with the orange truck.

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Got the interior primered and painted. Didn’t have many pics. This is just mid primer coat.

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Got a lot of little jobs done between coats of paint. Front shocks, calipers and brake lines, started putting the fuel lines in dismounted and cleaned and painted the fuel tank, Painted the steering column.

Good progress.
 

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Did some cleanup on the th350 with the wire cup on a drill. Transmission is dry / no fluid so I could flip it over easily.

Before:

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Then hit it with some aluma blast.

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I also did some work on securing the brake lines and fuel lines to the frame but still more to do there.

I won’t get back to the project for a few days, and so likely won’t meet the deadline I set for driving out of the shop on 7/31, and it’s all because I just find extra cool stuff to do like clean up a transmission that nobody is going to be looking at.
 
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HotWheelsBurban

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Did some cleanup on the th350 with the wire cup on a drill. Transmission is dry / no fluid so I could flip it over easily.

Before:

You must be registered for see images attach



After:

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Then hit it with some aluma blast.

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You must be registered for see images attach

I also did some work on securing the brake lines and fuel lines to the frame but still more to do there.

I won’t get back to the project for a few days, and so likely won’t meet the deadline I set for driving out of the shop on 7/31, and it’s all because I just find extra cool stuff to do like clean up a transmission that nobody is going to be looking at.
Yes, but you know it's clean now. And when they're clean(any truck parts, not just transmissions) it's lots easier to tell and see when they are leaking. And I'd lot rather get under a reasonably clean vehicle than a grungy nasty one. BTDT...
.
 

Trucksareforwork

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We spent some time today getting some major components together ahead of having to move out of the shop.

Mated the engine and transmission.

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Got the driveline into the frame

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We also put the cab back on with new body mounts. I didn’t snap any pics of that. Will add tomorrow.

Probably wont make much progress for a while until we get the temporary shop space we are moving to up to speed.
 

RecklessWOT

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Looks good! I prefer drums in the rear personally. A little More work but i only have to do it 1 time- to 3 or 4 times for front disk replacement usually.

I fully agree. Drums usually get better stopping power, better handling, and better mpg. Their only real weakness is rain/ mud and people that can't figure out how to change them. Once you invest in some basic tools, they're pretty easy.
literally no. Disc brakes are better for driveability/stopping power and are MUCH esier to work on. By design, drums are prone to locking up (ABS originated on the rear of pickups to stop them from locking up and swinging the ass end to the front). If they had better stopping power and handling then why would they have switched EVERY vehicle away from them? That's not even a matter of opinion, just physics and common sense. Even econoboxes like Civics and Corollas have rear discs these days, as do pickup trucks...
 
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RecklessWOT

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Got the front suspension clear of the old frame and continued scrubbing and degreasing until weather derailed it. I was surprised at how loose some of the fasteners were. Not sure what to make of that. The motor mounts were maybe hand tight and a few of the crossmember bolts were not exactly torqued either.

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Had my middle son scrubbing the suspension and my oldest starting to breakdown the motor.

Plan for tomorrow is to get the fro t suspension broken down further and painted, and then installed. Then we will at least have a roller.
huh, so that's what the front suspension of a 2wd rig looks like? Kinda neat. Pretty simple like a car, really. Never seen one with my own eyes, learn something new everyday. Up here a 2wd truck is basically useless, so you really never come across them. We get snow in the winter, and a TON of mud in the spring. A 2wd truck would essentially be as useful as that neighbor that keeps his 'vette or Camaro in storage all winter. But at least those are sports cars. Living up north my whole life, I couldn't imagine living every day like it was the middle of summer lol.
 
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Trucksareforwork

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huh, so that's what the front suspension of a 2wd rig looks like? Kinda neat. Pretty simple like a car, really. Never seen one with my own eyes, learn something new everyday. Up here a 2wd truck is basically useless, so you really never come across them. We get snow in the winter, and a TON of mud in the spring. A 2wd truck would essentially be as useful as that neighbor that keeps his 'vette or Camaro in storage all winter. But at least those are sports cars. Living up north my whole life, I couldn't imagine living every day like it was the middle of summer lol.
I grew up in the Deep South, basically coastal flatland and there the party line used to be that 4wd was just something else to fix.

I guess there are takers for all types.
 

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I grew up in the Deep South, basically coastal flatland and there the party line used to be that 4wd was just something else to fix.

I guess there are takers for all types.
oh yeah for sure, if you don't need it you don't need it. You'd get better mileage and less power loss without all those extra parts on there too. It's just funny, I've had front axles laying on the ground like that before and obviously I have seen 2wd trucks, but never seen the front suspension just ripped off like that. Wasn't trying to insult the truck if you took it that way, I was really just commenting about how I didn't imagine it would look that way.
 

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oh yeah for sure, if you don't need it you don't need it. You'd get better mileage and less power loss without all those extra parts on there too. It's just funny, I've had front axles laying on the ground like that before and obviously I have seen 2wd trucks, but never seen the front suspension just ripped off like that. Wasn't trying to insult the truck if you took it that way, I was really just commenting about how I didn't imagine it would look that way.
Didn’t take it that way.

And, besides, you can insult the truck all you want. I do it all the time, like yesterday when I couldn’t get the motor mounts lined up. I insulted it plenty. :)
 

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Didn’t take it that way.

And, besides, you can insult the truck all you want. I do it all the time, like yesterday when I couldn’t get the motor mounts lined up. I insulted it plenty. :)
Oh yeah I know exactly how that one-sided conversation goes. Sometimes entirely new curse words get made up lol
 

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literally no. Disc brakes are better for driveability/stopping power and are MUCH esier to work on. By design, drums are prone to locking up (ABS originated on the rear of pickups to stop them from locking up and swinging the ass end to the front). If they had better stopping power and handling then why would they have switched EVERY vehicle away from them? That's not even a matter of opinion, just physics and common sense. Even econoboxes like Civics and Corollas have rear discs these days, as do pickup trucks...
Everyone is entitled to an opinion. And for me it is sometimes a matter of application. Why would I need to swap to rear disk on our 99 suburban? it's Not necessary. I'm perfectly happy with the ones it came with from the factory and they work great. I'm not against disk brakes. I have a disk brake rear axle from a Yukon saved for a future project. I'm not going to feel dumb for appreciating drum brake technology lol.
 

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Everyone is entitled to an opinion. And for me it is sometimes a matter of application. Why would I need to swap to rear disk on our 99 suburban? it's Not necessary. I'm perfectly happy with the ones it came with from the factory and they work great. I'm not against disk brakes. I have a disk brake rear axle from a Yukon saved for a future project. I'm not going to feel dumb for appreciating drum brake technology lol.
I'm not suggesting anyone convert them (unless we're talking race cars or something) but let's not start lying to ourselves and saying that drum brakes have better driveability and stopping power lol. If it ain't broke don't fix it I agree, but they most certainly aren't "better" at anything besides being cheaper. Not an opinion, just the truth.
 

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I'm not suggesting anyone convert them (unless we're talking race cars or something) but let's not start lying to ourselves and saying that drum brakes have better driveability and stopping power lol. If it ain't broke don't fix it I agree, but they most certainly aren't "better" at anything besides being cheaper. Not an opinion, just the truth.
I'm still going to disagree. When comparing apples to oranges, disc is superior but apples to apples, a stock drum is better than a disc brake conversion.

To achieve the same braking power of a drum, you have to increase the diameter usually 10-20% or more. Look at the same vehicle that's offered both with disc and drum. You'll see a 10" drum and a 11" disc for example. In a conversion, you'll rarely find a caliper/ rotor combo that can match the performance of a drum until you are in the $2500k plus mark.

Drum brakes are oftentimes lighter than disc. Even if the rotor is lighter than the drum, the weight of the caliper bracket, caliper is usually substantially heavier than a drum backing plate and springs. This translates to less unsprung weight which makes a huge difference in handling and drivability.

Significantly more surface area of friction material. Disc typically needs 2-3x more friction material changes than a drum.

For many classes in roadracing, drums are preferred in the rear as they don't suffer from knockback. Unless you invest in a FF set-up at $2k plus.

Drum brakes don't drag like discs so better mpg.

Parking brakes work better. The manufactures have long struggled making an effective parking brake until the advent of electric parking brake pull

You can increase the wet weather performance of drums by cross drilling and switching to aluminum racing drums to help with heat.

Speaking of heat. have you ever warped a rotor, cracked a rotor or had a pad fall apart from heat? You probably have. Have you ever had a drum crack or warp? No, They take the heat and fade but keep on going.

It's ok to disagree with me but I rarely see an advantage to conversions, and I've done probably 25+. Yes. I do have 4 wheel disc on my '63 Nova but it was $7500k for the conversion, parts only. 15" Baer Rotors, 6 piston calipers, FF conversion. On my C10, I stayed with oversize drums. On my C30, I'll definitely stay with drums, on my K5 w/ a 14bolt FF I switched to discs as they were lighter than the big drum and I didn't need the stopping power of a 1T drum.

The manufacturers went to disc for wet weather performance and serviceability, but they also had to increase rotor size/ weight to get there and it took a long time to get there and it only works on a mass market item.
 

Trucksareforwork

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It's ok to disagree with me but I rarely see an advantage to conversions, and I've done probably 25+. Yes. I do have 4 wheel disc on my '63 Nova but it was $7500k for the conversion, parts only. 15" Baer Rotors, 6 piston calipers, FF conversion. On my C10, I stayed with oversize drums. On my C30, I'll definitely stay with drums, on my K5 w/ a 14bolt FF I switched to discs as they were lighter than the big drum and I didn't need the stopping power of a 1T drum.

The manufacturers went to disc for wet weather performance and serviceability, but they also had to increase rotor size/ weight to get there and it took a long time to get there and it only works on a mass market item.

Interesting rundown Benny. I have only done one disc conversion, on a 1967 Impala that my son and I did; and I share your view. The conversion used late 70's cadillac rear calipers, and setting up the parking brake was a mess, and I actually think I get less braking performance from the conversion than if I had just rebuilt the drums. As you can tell from this thread, I was previously inexperienced with drum brake rebuilds and thought the disc conversion was the quick ticket.

I also am struck by how many truly heavy-duty vehicles are drum braked. Pretty sure all you list points to the reasons for that.

Now, there is no doubt to me that discs provide better feel and braking power, per the prior posts, but only when sized and built for purpose, which a lot of conversions are not.
 

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I'm still going to disagree. When comparing apples to oranges, disc is superior but apples to apples, a stock drum is better than a disc brake conversion.

I'm not suggesting anyone convert them...




Significantly more surface area of friction material. Disc typically needs 2-3x more friction material changes than a drum.

Yep, that and the nearly instant full-engagement thing is the reason they're probably so prone to locking up.

Drum brakes don't drag like discs so better mpg.
extremely negligible when maintained properly, probably won't notice a difference in MPGs (unless we're talking a coast to coast roadtrip you might save 2 bucks) but what you WILL notice is the lack of take-up, disc brakes engage as soon as you hit the pedal there is no dead zone.

Parking brakes work better. The manufactures have long struggled making an effective parking brake until the advent of electric parking brake pull
People use parking brakes? Huh, weird idk if any of mine even work, never tried 'em (kinda kidding, but seriously that is at the bottom of the list of importance, what a stretch). But yeah you're right they're better in that regard, that's why most rear disc brake vehicles use little brake shoes on the inside surface of the rotor that fits over the hub, works exactly like a drum brake when you apply the parking brake (because it is a drum brake), but then when you're out on the road it works like a disc brake, because it's better.

have you ever warped a rotor, cracked a rotor or had a pad fall apart from heat? You probably have. Have you ever had a drum crack or warp? No, They take the heat and fade but keep on going.
Brake fade is basically the worst thing that can happen on a track OR highway. I'll take a severely warped rotor that needs to be turned or replaced any day, even when all wobbly it stops like a SOB, under NO circumatances is it okay for brakes to fade.

It's ok to disagree with me but I rarely see an advantage to conversions, and I've done probably 25+. Yes. I do have 4 wheel disc on my '63 Nova but it was $7500k for the conversion, parts only. 15" Baer Rotors, 6 piston calipers, FF conversion. On my C10, I stayed with oversize drums. On my C30, I'll definitely stay with drums, on my K5 w/ a 14bolt FF I switched to discs as they were lighter than the big drum and I didn't need the stopping power of a 1T drum.
Once again, I never suggested anyone convert them. If it ain't broke don't fix it. I was merely stating that drum brakes are basically inferior to discs in any scenario besides cost savings and since you mentioned it, parking brakes (wooooo...)

I've never spent $7500 on brakes. I've only ever spent that much or more on an entire vehicle once in my life (the wife's grocery getter and kid hauler, better be new and safe and fancy), and I have only ever spent more than that on an engine build once, and I have maybe $800-1000 into the brakes on that vehicle max, stops great with its nearly stock 4 wheel disc setup (just upgraded parts, all stock calipers and rotor size, etc) even at 150+mph. If I warp a rotor, I go home and throw another one on for like 100 bucks...


To each their own, I really don't want a fight here. But man, you will not convince me ever. As I said before, if it's rear drum stock, go ahead and leave it alone, maybe use upgraded components. But there is nothing on God's green earth that will make me think drum brakes have better road manners than discs, they just don't...
 
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