454 running hot

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cobbisbobobbis

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Hello, I just got a '73 GMC C25 with a 454/400 and it's been running pretty hot (3/4th on the gauge) what can I do to make it run cooler? The radiator is pretty new and the temp sender was replaced at the same time. The thermostat seems to open but maybe it's on it's way out? The water pump isn't weeping from what I can tell. The only thing I can think to replace would be the thermostat, radiator cap, hoses and maybe loop the heater core lines/cap them off. Where I live having a heater isn't really a priority, doesn't get that cold. Thank you in advance!
 

Chevy 88

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Gauge is not accurate. It shows changes in temps, not actual temps.
Verify temps before making changes.

To drop temps:

Pull thermostat and garden hose flush followed by distilled and then add coolant. Leave thermostat out for now, during testing.
Get the temps too low, and then work to raise them up. Its an easier and safer battle.
Check rad fan clutch and replace as needed.
 

legopnuematic

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Being you are in California, was the truck ran with straight water or real antifreeze?

When it’s running and up to temp, is the upper radiator hose hot? Cold? That would give a pretty good idea if the thermostat is opening.
 

nvrenuf

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You say the radiator is “pretty new”, is it comparable in size to the original?

Do you have a fan shroud?
Mechanical or electric fan?
 

cobbisbobobbis

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Gauge is not accurate. It shows changes in temps, not actual temps.
Verify temps before making changes.

To drop temps:

Pull thermostat and garden hose flush followed by distilled and then add coolant. Leave thermostat out for now, during testing.
Get the temps too low, and then work to raise them up. Its an easier and safer battle.
Check rad fan clutch and replace as needed.
Okay good to know. Thank you, I'll try that here pretty soon.
Being you are in California, was the truck ran with straight water or real antifreeze?

When it’s running and up to temp, is the upper radiator hose hot? Cold? That would give a pretty good idea if the thermostat is opening.
It was ran with actual antifreeze and it looks decent, no rust or anything like that. The upper radiator hose gets really hot, the heater core hoses aren't hot at all though.
You say the radiator is “pretty new”, is it comparable in size to the original?

Do you have a fan shroud?
Mechanical or electric fan?
Yes it's probably the same size as the original. Yes I have a fan shroud and it also has a mechanical fan.
"gauge" is an indicator not actual temp. Should only be used to see changes from a normal reading.
What do you mean?
 

Sad Sack

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I have used this product with some degree of measurable success:

 

82sbshortbed

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My 454 ran anywhere from 195 to 210 with 185 thermostat in it. Sensor is in the driver's side head.
 

cobbisbobobbis

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I have used this product with some degree of measurable success:

How does that work?? Seems too good to be true lmao.
My 454 ran anywhere from 195 to 210 with 185 thermostat in it. Sensor is in the driver's side head.
Yeah I think this one is running like 230-240, which is definitely too hot.

Something I've noticed is that there might be an obstruction in the lower radiator hose, it feels like there's something in there like a spring that they used to form the hose but it isn't in the right place anymore so it's just sitting there. Also the hoses going to the heater core are completely cool when both of the other hoses are super hot. What's that all about?
 

Sad Sack

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How does that work?? Seems too good to be true lmao.

Yeah I think this one is running like 230-240, which is definitely too hot.

Something I've noticed is that there might be an obstruction in the lower radiator hose, it feels like there's something in there like a spring that they used to form the hose but it isn't in the right place anymore so it's just sitting there. Also the hoses going to the heater core are completely cool when both of the other hoses are super hot. What's that all about?
I have used it in two cars, Corvette with a supercharger, a Trans Am, and both using the factory gauges for reference it would lower running temps by about 15ish degrees. I would definitely use again if there was a need in any of my vehicles. I still may get a bottle for my '85.
 

Grit dog

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How does that work?? Seems too good to be true lmao.

Yeah I think this one is running like 230-240, which is definitely too hot.

Something I've noticed is that there might be an obstruction in the lower radiator hose, it feels like there's something in there like a spring that they used to form the hose but it isn't in the right place anymore so it's just sitting there. Also the hoses going to the heater core are completely cool when both of the other hoses are super hot. What's that all about?
Water wetter works like it’s advertised but it’s in no way a bandaid for a poor cooling system.
First figure out if it’s actually running hot. Your diagnosis to date has not done that. Nor have you said whether the fan is working properly. Can you hear it?
Figure out what’s wrong with heater hose routing or plugged? heater core. Looping them together will make it run hotter than a properly functioning cooling/heating system.
Lastly if it’s running 240deg I’m quite surprised it’s not puking coolant or some other bad symptoms.
Also do a little learning on what does what in a cooling system.
For instance if it’s not puking out the overflow, the cap isnt the problem.
 

legopnuematic

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Ok, so if the upper radiator hose is getting hot, that suggests that the thermostat is opening in some capacity.

If the heater hoses are cold, that suggests either a blockage or lack of flow, such as the impeller on the water pump failed, or eroded away, etc.

Probably the easiest way to get a basic idea is to disconnect the hose from the intake manifold, hook a temporary hose a few feet long draining into a clean bucket from the manifold outlet, start the truck, it should begin moving coolant through the hose, regardless of thermostat position. If you have fluid movement from the manifold, reconnect and disconnect the heater core to radiator hose, plug the radiator hole, then hose into a bucket and run the truck again, if no flow into bucket, suggests clogged heater core, potentially a hose/obstruction.

If you don’t have any movement of coolant in the first test, investigate the water pump, and radiator hoses. Coolant does degrade over time, most people let it go way longer than it should, silicates in the coolant, along with external debris that made its way into the system can erode/corrode a steel impeller over time, or with straight water, rust, to the point the fins are totally gone. The pump doesn’t have to weep or leak to have failed.
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A thermal image gun or a temp gun is useful to for this type of diagnosis.

Also, a lean fuel mixture or late ignition timing can cause overheating too. With the heater core being cold, I don’t believe that is the main/root cause in this scenario. Just something to note.

Here is a couple pictures from the net on what can happen to an impeller:
You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach
 

cobbisbobobbis

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You could have a blockage in the water pump inlet/outlet. they don't need to be "weeping" to be clogged...
That's good to know, thank you.
Water wetter works like it’s advertised but it’s in no way a bandaid for a poor cooling system.
First figure out if it’s actually running hot. Your diagnosis to date has not done that. Nor have you said whether the fan is working properly. Can you hear it?
Figure out what’s wrong with heater hose routing or plugged? heater core. Looping them together will make it run hotter than a properly functioning cooling/heating system.
Lastly if it’s running 240deg I’m quite surprised it’s not puking coolant or some other bad symptoms.
Also do a little learning on what does what in a cooling system.
For instance if it’s not puking out the overflow, the cap isnt the problem.
Yeah the fan works, I would say that it runs too hot for sure. I don't have access to a thermal gun to measure the temperature. It isn't doing all of those things so that's good then.
Ok, so if the upper radiator hose is getting hot, that suggests that the thermostat is opening in some capacity.

If the heater hoses are cold, that suggests either a blockage or lack of flow, such as the impeller on the water pump failed, or eroded away, etc.

Probably the easiest way to get a basic idea is to disconnect the hose from the intake manifold, hook a temporary hose a few feet long draining into a clean bucket from the manifold outlet, start the truck, it should begin moving coolant through the hose, regardless of thermostat position. If you have fluid movement from the manifold, reconnect and disconnect the heater core to radiator hose, plug the radiator hole, then hose into a bucket and run the truck again, if no flow into bucket, suggests clogged heater core, potentially a hose/obstruction.

If you don’t have any movement of coolant in the first test, investigate the water pump, and radiator hoses. Coolant does degrade over time, most people let it go way longer than it should, silicates in the coolant, along with external debris that made its way into the system can erode/corrode a steel impeller over time, or with straight water, rust, to the point the fins are totally gone. The pump doesn’t have to weep or leak to have failed.
You must be registered for see images attach


A thermal image gun or a temp gun is useful to for this type of diagnosis.

Also, a lean fuel mixture or late ignition timing can cause overheating too. With the heater core being cold, I don’t believe that is the main/root cause in this scenario. Just something to note.

Here is a couple pictures from the net on what can happen to an impeller:
You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach
Okay sounds good, I'll do that test here soon. Thank you for the information everyone!
 

fast 99

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"gauge" is an indicator not actual temp. Should only be used to see changes from a normal reading.
What do you mean?



What I mean is they are notoriously inaccurate.

All the above suggestions are good however, do you really know if it has a problem? Is it boiling over or pushing coolant out? If not, buy a $20 harbor freight temp gun and do some diagnosis first. Feeling how hot or going by the dash cluster isn't reliable. An alternate method is buying a mechanical temp gauge. One poster mentioned the head temperature was higher than the thermostat. Cylinder head will usually run 10-15 degrees hotter than stat. So where temp sender is located has an effect on the reading.
 

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