Cam selection for a 70's Malibu

[Driver4r]

This is like the cam i have in my truck. It has a lope to it, and ive gotten comments on how it sounds. I idle around 700rpm. But the lift..... Make sure first.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevrolet-C...Parts_Accessories&hash=item4854dd006f&vxp=mtr

Theres 2 versions of it:
1800-5200
2200-5800

But if you tent to advance the cam. If you go 4deg. im gonna guess it would put the 2200 at around 1900.

 

[philjafo]

Not bad advice either to call a cam grinder, but there are so many options to choose from today, I bet he can find one without a custom grind. A cheap $59 Summit Cam will do the job well, and I think it's about $100 for a Summit Cam and Lifters.

If you have 2 pushrods NOT going up and down, that means you've likely got flat cam lobes maybe caused by someone over tightening the valves. Hard to diagnose bent push rods. In MOST cases, but not all, bent push rods come from over revving and floating valves. SBC's aren't zero clearance motors so that didn't do it.

By call your favorite cam grinder I meant luniti, comp, or whatever other company has tech support to help choose the correct off the shelf grind. Definately no need for a custom grind, its a SBC after all not some oddball flathead airplane motor.

 

[HotRodPC]

By call your favorite cam grinder I meant luniti, comp, or whatever other company has tech support to help choose the correct off the shelf grind. Definately no need for a custom grind, its a SBC after all not some oddball flathead airplane motor.

OK, I get it. I do know a cam grinder right here in OKC. He'll grind up anything you want so long as he has a blank and if he don't have a blank, bring him your old one and he'll build it up and grind it down to what you want within reason. That's what I thought you were referring to.

Comp Cams has some real nice grinds. For a basic stocker motor needing a little pep, The Summit brand cam and lifter kits are nicely priced too and work very well with a fairly good selection, but not near the selection Comp Cams has. I really like the Comp Cams names their cams in series. You can have 2 cams real close to the same Lift & Duration, but one is in the High Energy name and the other in the another name. Difference usually being a different purpose on a different lobe center angle so the range is different. That's what I mean by, with all the cam technology out today, the degreeing in a cam to advance or retad cam timing is not needed these days. Just get the cam you want already ground and set it in straight up and done.

 

[El Camino Man]

Comp Cams has some real nice grinds. I really like the Comp Cams names their cams in series.

Mmmm Mutha Thumpr

 

[HotRodPC]

Mmmm Mutha Thumpr

Yeah, the all sound no go grind. As said, you can get any cam you want these days.

Cams with moderate lift and duration but on a 105 or 106 Lobe Center Angle which equates to a turd off the line and bad fuel mileage. But yep, they SOUND good.

So how is it for a cam with a smooth or fair idle with the same lift and duration but on a 112 degree LCA and spank the dog **** out that Thumper Cam. Now if you're racing for a mile, the Thumper will get the job done, but not in the 1/8 mile and it MIGHT be able to chase you down in the big end of the 1/4 mile.

That's what gets me, people will go with things like loud exhaust and thumper cams and they're as fake as Pamela Andersons ****.

I'll keep my **** quiet, smooth idle, better mpg and spank their asses all day long. But that's just me.

 

[El Camino Man]

Easy Trigger! I just like the name lol

 

[HotRodPC]

Easy Trigger! I just like the name lol

I know that, I was just putting in my .02 as to why I don't like the Thumper Series. I like the High Energy and really like the Xtreme Energy Series. You can really make yourself a nice sleeper with the low to mid size High Energy Series Cams. The Xtreme Eneregy series is a more aggresive performance line of grinds and not very economical, but they're equal sounding the performance gain as in a good match. Thumper is just a bunch of bumpity bumpity bump noise.

 

[Christian Nelson]

Well, yes. All of the things y'all are saying ar correct, I don't disagree. But I hate to say it, you aren't helping with the walleye vision.

There are probably 10,000 cams that fit what you are saying.. I am looking for some suggestions, specific cam grinds you've used, or look good to you, to narrow my search. So far, a couple of you have given me some suggestions. I don't wanna call any cam maker til I have it narrowed down to like 3 of their cams, and ask them to tel me which they thing of the three would work best.

I like the idea of SUmmit, cheaper cmas, since this friend doesn't have much money.

I've heard a car can get away with more duration than a truck, since they are lighter and aren't puling. The cam mentioned by Driver4r looks nice, not sure if his heads can handle the lift though. Any other specific cams liked? I know there was another one, but it is on the previous page, and I can't remember who posted, or what it was, but thank you.

Comp cams suggestion with the high energy I will look into those.

You realize literally several thousand cams show up for chev small block on Summits website, right? I really dislike their setup, I wish they'd have them grouped to what rpm ranges they work with best, etc.. SO you don't have to click on each of them to see more info about them.

 

[Christian Nelson]

see there ya go comp 268h has only 454 lift, so it's under the limit and its bumpity bump somewhat.

Thanks swim. I will look at this one.

My friend is hoping to be able to pull the lifters out with a magnet, so he doesn't have to pull the intake. I think he's nuts, but if it works, what can I say?

 

[HotRodPC]

Well, yes. All of the things y'all are saying ar correct, I don't disagree. But I hate to say it, you aren't helping with the walleye vision.

There are probably 10,000 cams that fit what you are saying.. I am looking for some suggestions, specific cam grinds you've used, or look good to you, to narrow my search. So far, a couple of you have given me some suggestions. I don't wanna call any cam maker til I have it narrowed down to like 3 of their cams, and ask them to tel me which they thing of the three would work best.

I like the idea of SUmmit, cheaper cmas, since this friend doesn't have much money.

I've heard a car can get away with more duration than a truck, since they are lighter and aren't puling. The cam mentioned by Driver4r looks nice, not sure if his heads can handle the lift though. Any other specific cams liked? I know there was another one, but it is on the previous page, and I can't remember who posted, or what it was, but thank you.

Comp cams suggestion with the high energy I will look into those.

You realize literally several thousand cams show up for chev small block on Summits website, right? I really dislike their setup, I wish they'd have them grouped to what rpm ranges they work with best, etc.. SO you don't have to click on each of them to see more info about them.

If you want a specific cam picked out, I can do that too. I can pretty much tell you what it is, what it will do, and how it will perform. I'll look a couple up. I do know the H268 Swims is talking about is not a bad cam at all, but I don't recall it being a bumpity cam. It's a fairly smooth idle if I recall. You probably wouldn't want to run the cams I've ran in the past in small blocks. They were like 505 lift, 310 duration on 108 Lobe Center, or a 525 Lift, 312 duration IIRC. Those are radical in small blocks and you can see the gas dripping out the tailpipe at idle, with a 750 double pumper carb. I'll look at a couple budget cams, since obviously your buddy is trying to cheap out if he's not willing to pull the intake. And I'll respond to that in your next post with quote.

 

[HotRodPC]

Thanks swim. I will look at this one.

My friend is hoping to be able to pull the lifters out with a magnet, so he doesn't have to pull the intake. I think he's nuts, but if it works, what can I say?

You're buddy is more than nuts for not wanting to pull the intake. He's flat out on crack and you need to do him a favor and let him know that.

#1 with oiled lifters and the suction factor, I doubt he'll get a strong enough magnet. I won't say it can't be done, but I say it's not likely. And it will only take 1 lifter to hang of 16 and he's pulling it anyway. Along with, the lifters are probably a tad mushroomed on the bases. Even so slighty but they won't come up as easy as he'll wish.

#2 and most important. He's whacked to think he can use those same worn lifters on a new camshaft and expect that cam to last more than 5000 miles, and probably not even 1000 miles before he wipes out at least 1 lobe. A lifter base breaks in and has a wear pattern to the lobe its on and they become married. Now if he's thinking he's already gotten 2 wiped out lobes on a camshaft, why in the hell would he even consider trying to save the lifters??? Can you imagine the wear pattern on those lifters with the worn lobes? NOOOOOOOOOOO !!! Pull the intake, New Cam and NEW LIFTERS !!!
I'm not saying you can't reuse lifters. You can in some cases. But when you have failed lobes on a cam, that's not a time you want to reuse lifters.

 

[Christian Nelson]

If you want a specific cam picked out, I can do that too. I can pretty much tell you what it is, what it will do, and how it will perform. I'll look a couple up. I do know the H268 Swims is talking about is not a bad cam at all, but I don't recall it being a bumpity cam. It's a fairly smooth idle if I recall. You probably wouldn't want to run the cams I've ran in the past in small blocks. They were like 505 lift, 310 duration on 108 Lobe Center, or a 525 Lift, 312 duration IIRC. Those are radical in small blocks and you can see the gas dripping out the tailpipe at idle, with a 750 double pumper carb. I'll look at a couple budget cams, since obviously your buddy is trying to cheap out if he's not willing to pull the intake. And I'll respond to that in your next post with quote.

Yes, he's being cheap. He has literally no money. He just went through bankruptcy, got kicked out of his home by the bank who wouldn't deal with him, and they auctioned it for $30k, when he was willing to pay what he owed, but couldn't at 22% interest they just one day decided to jack his rate to. His son bought this car, and it began running funny, and they opened up the rocker covers to find a couple of them barely moving. At first, I suggested maybe the bolts holing the rockers had gotten pushed up, since they weren't pinned, but he looked at it more, and says the pushrods aren't moving much either, so bad cam, or collapsed lifters..

So, he's thinking if he has to replace the cam anyhow, he might as well get the best one he can for the $$ and he has an even worse problem with walleyevision than I do. I at least kinda know I want to keep the lift below what the Vortecs can handle, if I can get a straight answer about that, which you guys gave me. Thank you.. .465 I know best cam for just driving with decent power is gonna be lower end rpm, and those don't rumble too much.

But, he's got dual exhaust, and even a littl rumble should be noticable with that.

So, I am seeing quite a few lower rpm (below 1900 range) cams and was just looking for some suggested good ones..

I thank you all for any help, I am sorry if I sounded like I was not appreciative.

I just kinda know the direction I wanna go, part of my toruble is the stupid sorting layout of Summit's website.

But there's also the problem where there's like several hundred cams that fit this critera, and well, which one is best?

Yes, I know the guy is cheaping out, and being abit unrealistic, but he's just not able to spend much money. He's not knowlegable enough to do head work, and doesn't have the $$ to pay someone else. If the cam bearings are shot, etc, he's done, he can't afford to rebuild the engine, and will look for a junk small block to just run til he can get the funds together to rebuild it..

I'm just rying to help the guy, I've got a bunch on my plate too, so I can't really take on the job of building his engine for him either right now..

 

[Christian Nelson]

You're buddy is more than nuts for not wanting to pull the intake. He's flat out on crack and you need to do him a favor and let him know that.

#1 with oiled lifters and the suction factor, I doubt he'll get a strong enough magnet. I won't say it can't be done, but I say it's not likely. And it will only take 1 lifter to hang of 16 and he's pulling it anyway. Along with, the lifters are probably a tad mushroomed on the bases. Even so slighty but they won't come up as easy as he'll wish.

#2 and most important. He's whacked to think he can use those same worn lifters on a new camshaft and expect that cam to last more than 5000 miles, and probably not even 1000 miles before he wipes out at least 1 lobe. A lifter base breaks in and has a wear pattern to the lobe its on and they become married. Now if he's thinking he's already gotten 2 wiped out lobes on a camshaft, why in the hell would he even consider trying to save the lifters??? Can you imagine the wear pattern on those lifters with the worn lobes? NOOOOOOOOOOO !!! Pull the intake, New Cam and NEW LIFTERS !!!
I'm not saying you can't reuse lifters. You can in some cases. But when you have failed lobes on a cam, that's not a time you want to reuse lifters.

Yes, I agree. He knows that too, but he's gonna try to pull the lifters with a magnet. He says if it doesn't work, he'll pull the intake, but he wants to try it.

I was actually going to try to find a lifter/cam combo for him, since I know what you are saying about the lifters being shot.

He's gonna need pushrods too, he wants to try straightening the one bent one. Yes, I know I will probably just buy push rods for him too.

If he's VERY LUCKY, I think he will get away with intake/timing/valvecover gaskets, lifters cam pushrods. and I would include timingchain too, but he may not want to.. I'd also buy a jig to cut down the valve guides, better springs, and lower the seats, and widen my cam choices, get a NICE high lift low duration cam, I'd shave the heads, to up the compression, do alight portmatch, and probably ditch the 750 double pump carb, and put a Q-jet on it, with a dual plane manifold setup instead of the big open square hole he has now..

But, he doesn't have the $$, and I can't afford the time, or the money to do it for him right.

 

[HotRodPC]

Yes, he's being cheap. He has literally no money. He just went through bankruptcy, got kicked out of his home by the bank who wouldn't deal with him, and they auctioned it for $30k, when he was willing to pay what he owed, but couldn't at 22% interest they just one day decided to jack his rate to. His son bought this car, and it began running funny, and they opened up the rocker covers to find a couple of them barely moving. At first, I suggested maybe the bolts holing the rockers had gotten pushed up, since they weren't pinned, but he looked at it more, and says the pushrods aren't moving much either, so bad cam, or collapsed lifters..

So, he's thinking if he has to replace the cam anyhow, he might as well get the best one he can for the $$ and he has an even worse problem with walleyevision than I do. I at least kinda know I want to keep the lift below what the Vortecs can handle, if I can get a straight answer about that, which you guys gave me. Thank you.. .465 I know best cam for just driving with decent power is gonna be lower end rpm, and those don't rumble too much.

But, he's got dual exhaust, and even a littl rumble should be noticable with that.

So, I am seeing quite a few lower rpm (below 1900 range) cams and was just looking for some suggested good ones..

I thank you all for any help, I am sorry if I sounded like I was not appreciative.

I just kinda know the direction I wanna go, part of my toruble is the stupid sorting layout of Summit's website.

But there's also the problem where there's like several hundred cams that fit this critera, and well, which one is best?

Yes, I know the guy is cheaping out, and being abit unrealistic, but he's just not able to spend much money. He's not knowlegable enough to do head work, and doesn't have the $$ to pay someone else. If the cam bearings are shot, etc, he's done, he can't afford to rebuild the engine, and will look for a junk small block to just run til he can get the funds together to rebuild it..

I'm just rying to help the guy, I've got a bunch on my plate too, so I can't really take on the job of building his engine for him either right now..

To be cheap, here's 2 I'd consider. Cam and Lifters $100.

Here would be my #1 choice for what you're describing. Notice to variable lift and duration on intake and exhaust. Notice the RPM Power band range of 1500-5200, and this is on a 112 Lobe Seperation which means it's going to pull good from the lower end into mid range so he'll feel it a little bit and get set back in the seat. I'm sure we're dealing with a stock compression motor of about 8.5:1 with some wear it's probably actually 8.0 - 8.25:1 at best. You don't really want any bumpitybump on a low compression motor. BumpidyBumb means there is valve overlap and you're leaking off compression. At that low of compression, you can't afford to leak off any compression without losing mega power and then you're just adding gas to weak combustion and no considerable gain. This cam should be fair on mpg also since it's not radical at all, and on a 112 Lobe Sep angle and be pulling from the low end, so he won't need to give a ton of throttle to get it moving.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-k1103/overview/make/chevrolet


Here would be my 2nd Choice. A little more lift, a little more duration. But it's not variable. A higher power band range that starts at 2000 which is a little high for a stock conveter, but he'll sure feel it turn on mid range if he nails the skinny pedal from a 25mph roll, he's going to know of it for sure. It's still on a 114 Lobe Seperation, so it will still pull good from the low end of that power band range. It's also not going to be radical and should not give up much compression but still have some real good mid range performance. Not going to be as good on mpg as the first choice since he'll have to give a little throttle to get it moving, but it won't be to bad on mpg for highway mileage at all. I don't think he'd be given up much mpg on the highway, but will suffer just a tad in the city.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-k1104/overview/make/chevrolet

 

[HotRodPC]

Yes, I agree. He knows that too, but he's gonna try to pull the lifters with a magnet. He says if it doesn't work, he'll pull the intake, but he wants to try it.

I was actually going to try to find a lifter/cam combo for him, since I know what you are saying about the lifters being shot.

He's gonna need pushrods too, he wants to try straightening the one bent one. Yes, I know I will probably just buy push rods for him too.

If he's VERY LUCKY, I think he will get away with intake/timing/valvecover gaskets, lifters cam pushrods. and I would include timingchain too, but he may not want to.. I'd also buy a jig to cut down the valve guides, better springs, and lower the seats, and widen my cam choices, get a NICE high lift low duration cam, I'd shave the heads, to up the compression, do alight portmatch, and probably ditch the 750 double pump carb, and put a Q-jet on it, with a dual plane manifold setup instead of the big open square hole he has now..

But, he doesn't have the $$, and I can't afford the time, or the money to do it for him right.

I know how it is to be broke and need to work on ****, but sometimes you just can't skimp. Pushrods are $3 each. He can get by with buying the 2 or 3 that's bent, or if you guys have a Pull A Part, go spend a $1 to get in and snag a few in your back pocket. WTH, PAP isn't going to miss a few push rods when a dude is down on his luck and broke as hell. You now, if he's that broke, maybe he should just go to PAP, find a cleaner looking 350, and get the cam and lifters out of a motor and buy it at PAP. Just be sure to take 2 egg crates to mark the lifters so you can put the same lifter with the same lobes on the cam. SBC's don't commonly have a problem wiping out cam lobes. So a good used Cam with the same lifters on the same lobes will get him by and all he has to buy new is is the timing cover and intake gaskets. He can probably get cam and lifters for $20-$25 at PAP, snag a few push rods and get it up and running.