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th350 case advise

Discussion in 'Automatic Transmission' started by Tyger13us, Dec 23, 2018.

  1. Tyger13us

    Tyger13us Full Access Member

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    Ok,, thanks dude...

    I did notice that there wasnt a wave plate in the direct 4 clutch pac,, so i rounded one up and trying to set the direct drum up...

    but its too tight,, no clearance for the clutches,, i looked over the other direct drums,, out of for sure v8 trucks.
    but it has the same problem,, no clearance..

    Soooooooo,, i guess i will just leave out the wave plate in the direct clutch drum..
    it has .045 clearance with 4 clutches and 4 steals..

    no room for an extra steel and clutch,, or a wave plate...

    rule of thumb has always been? going from memory here,,, .010 for every clutch....

    thought about having the piston turned down,, but havent completely made up my mind yet...

    id have to buy all new clutches and steels for the direct drum if i went that route...

    its early,, aint even had coffee yet.....
     
  2. Matt69olds

    Matt69olds Full Access Member

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    You can machine the piston to accept 5 clutches. If your planning on beating up on a 350 the5clutvhes should be considered mandatory. I have cut them on a brake drum lathe, shoot for .010- .015 per friction.

    Are you using a shift kit with a transfer plate to dual-feed the direct clutches? If not, another must do. A wide direct drum bushing is also a good idea
     
  3. Tyger13us

    Tyger13us Full Access Member

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    ok.. decided to go through the whole 9 yards......
    full kit clutches and steels,, all bushings and seals,, intermediate sprag and HD race,, low and revers sprag with the bolt in case saver..
    also going to use the anti clunk spring..
    wide direct drum bushing,, double up on the sun gear bushings..

    I have a trans go th350 1&2 kit already with the dual feed set up for the direct drum..
    red pressure spring and all the other trans go kit stuff....
    im thinking thats what save this dieing trans that came with the truck......

    i have a question for the Trans go kit users?
    it has that stacked blue spring in the 1st gear ANYTIME,, even @ 6000k rpm...
    dont fuck up and get first by mistake,,,,, boom,, there goes the motor...

    So what other spring would be good to use there?
    i have a green one that came with the valve body kit also,,

    but the one page photo copy dont say shit about it......

    it only shows the stacked blue 1st gear anytime stacked spring........

    it would be good,, if i was out in the BFE bouncing around and didnt hit 1st/low when ya hit one of those OH fuck ditches or holes.....
    flying around in the cab can hit the gear shift lever preety easy............ its happened before..........

    trans go calls it shift command,, more like blow your motor up,, woops.....

    since i have the kit,, really didnt want to use the stock spring? for 1st/low gear.....

    i know someone out there knows what im talking about..........

    just so ya all know...

    its a 69.. 010 casting high nickle 4 bolt main block,, .040 over and decked,, line bored and all the good shit done to it..

    cast iron crank balanced and blued,camfered oil holes and all,, ive broken to many steel cranks,, never broken a cast crank done right...

    droped forged seal power pistons,, balanced pink x rods,, Arp rod bolts molly rings...ya know,, done right...

    the dude did a shit job on a pair of 041 camel heads and 1 head droped an exhaust seat...

    This was on a NEW build motor... tore it down,, pulled the beat up piston,, new piston,, rings and bearings for that hole..
    the motor only had 2k on it.....still fresh...

    went and bought a pare of Dart Iron Eagles 160/202,, 200cc intake ports and 64 cc chambers with the matching Dart Intake...
    not quite 11:1 like it was with the 62cc heads,, but close enough......

    just by bolting on the heads and matcing in take,, i pretty much gained 100hp and who knows how much torque??

    so,, thats what the th350 was doing after fixing the machine shop fuck up i ATE.. they went out of busyness..

    long story,, thats what this th350 is in for... decided not to do the 5 clutch drum..
    ive had 500-600 hp in front of a th350 before and it lived in 4 different street rods..
    the last car was wreaked beyond salvaging parts....well except for the B&M 5000 stall converter...lol...
    900 sum bucks back in them daze...
     
  4. Matt69olds

    Matt69olds Full Access Member

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    The 5 clutches in the direct drum a easy improvement. It’s a good idea. Anything you can do to improve surface area, the dual feed is a huge benefit, the extra clutch just makes a good thing better
     
  5. Tyger13us

    Tyger13us Full Access Member

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    ok,, got another dumbass ???

    i went out and tore down a BOP th350 today since the mud is drying up a lil,, ya can walk around a little...

    It would seem that it was behind a v6,, and thats by going on the clutch count,, 1 less clutch in all the places where clutches are..

    it has full torington bearing throughout... the rear plant gear looks a lil wimpy? compaired to the one that came out of the truck..
    im guessing its because its machined for the torington,, other wise the same..

    Input shaft and forward drum look spanking new,, but the input shaft that goes into the output shaft has that big ole dick end to it with the nylon o-ring,, not the plastic insert/bushing type end...

    there is no bushing in the end of the output shaft,, where the input shaft goes in to it...
    this other shaft with this new fangled o-ring is a perfect fit...

    how do the new shaft design hold up? or should i just use the plastic bushing insert?
    the end of the org shaft is to messed up to use a brass bushing...

    i know i will have to change the piston in the forward drum,, to the 5 clutch piston...

    i also noticed the input shaft is like a 1/4 inch shorter...

    hell,, i dont know,, thats why im asking,, if in doubt ask someone......

    didnt find jack on the web about this kind of input shaft......

    its not a lock up trans...

    if needed i could post picks?

    i was reading back in a prior post about using all torington bearing if possible..
    the trans didnt even have 60k on it before the motor threw a rod,,v6...
    so the guy i got it from put a v8 and 4sp in the car.....

    this was so long ago,, i almost forgot about i had this trans..think it an 82?

    woops,, forgot to post this,,,
     
  6. Irishman999

    Irishman999 Full Access Member

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    I can build a stout th350 for a few hundred bucks. I have a parts guy that can get you a good rebuild kit for almost nothing shipped to your door. I always do the bolt in center support in th350's and 700R4's, I also use a case saver for double strength.
     
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  7. Tyger13us

    Tyger13us Full Access Member

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    Update......

    today UPS delivered the th350 trans kit i ordered.. https://www.oregonperformancetransmission.com/product/OPT-TH350-RB.html

    best deal i could find.. i got the hardened direct drum race and steels and some Assembly goop...

    i also got the bolt in case saver.. https://www.oregonperformancetransmission.com/product/ADC-A74761D.html
    also.. best price i could find.... it all got here in 3 daze..

    now i gotta get a Wide lower bearing sprag for the case saver...
    and i have been looking at this 5 clutch piston for the direct drum... http://www.ckperformance.com/View/TH350-FIVE-FRICTION-DIRECT-CLUTCH-PISTON

    looks like a good heavy duty part,, more beef to it than the pistons in the drums i have,,oem..

    there rayspestos steels...made in USA

    the kit came with borgwarner clutches and band..
    it says made in Korea... so much for Borgwarner QUALITY......
    I guess preaty much NOTHING is made in the USA anymore...
    Knowing that Borgwarner stuff is made in Korea now?

    what brand of wide Lower sprag should i get for the case saver?
    or they all the same any more.......SMH........
    sigh..........

    And i Blew 24 bucks on the ATSG th350c manual/disk,, it has a regular 350 subsection on it....
    But now i have the book,, since my memory is fading,, im getting old and cant remember shit "CRS" like i used to....
    I have to write everything down anymore...... and it seems like i cant type for shit/or spell ether......lol...
    But i know what i mean........hahahahahaha i think?

    Oh and thanks Irishman and Matt for the input.............
     
  8. HotRodPC

    HotRodPC Administrator Staff Member

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    Looks like a good kit and plans. If it's not a lock up converter case, I do like the transfer plate method also for the dual feeding better than the more detailed manual method of doing it. I know many prefer the Trans Go kits, but for a Th350, the B&M Shift Improver Kit has always worked for me. It also includes the tranfer plate.

    IIRC, the direct 5 clutch piston is just a standard OEM V8 piston.
     
  9. 71RAT

    71RAT Junior Member

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    I've use several of these, best option to replacing the case. Also upgrades to the larger 4l60e low roller.
    Just my opinion and experience.
     
  10. Tyger13us

    Tyger13us Full Access Member

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    Well? i got it all back together,, .013 end play, with full roller thrust bearings,, and all the trick shit.......

    im on the last assembley,, the valve body........

    As ya may know,, maybe not? it had a transgo 1-2 kit,, with the red spring... truck heavy duty seting.......

    there is a defect in the dual feed plate,, ive looked around,, ALOT and found out this plate does this alot......
    it warps to the point to where the dual feed leaks pressure......Because there is no support behind it,,where that big ole square feed hole goes from the case to the pump.. the suction pump feed hole from the valve body...

    DSCN0128.JPG

    i got a couple pics before my camera died..




    DSCN0116.JPG

    Soooooooooooooooooo?
    should i just drill out an oem plate to match the trans go plate? and not do the duel feed?
    or,, drill the oem plate to match the trans go plate and sanwich it behind on the case to give the transgo plate more suport behind it so it wont be losing pressure at the weak point......


    DSCN0123.JPG
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
  11. Matt69olds

    Matt69olds Full Access Member

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    Your suppose to have the factory transfer plate on top of the parts included in the TransGo kit. If I remember correctly, there is a thin plate that blocks a couple holes, then a plate with the dual feed channel, another plate, and then the factory plate. I’ll find some instructions in the morning and post a couple pics. Or you could probably find instructions online, TCI, TransGo, B&M, etc all use the same method to dual feed
     
  12. Matt69olds

    Matt69olds Full Access Member

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    BFEE646E-F47D-4B97-9261-FD30443F9166.jpeg
     
  13. Tyger13us

    Tyger13us Full Access Member

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    the th350 1&2 kit i have has the transfer dual feed plate spot welded to the case metering plate...

    there is no separate duel feed plates like that, that comes in the b&m kit.....

    the gasket are top and bottom plate gaskets,, then the duel feed gasket the kit includes covers "there" duel feed plate,, then ya use the oem flat plate spacer support on top of the dual feed plate as usual.....

    it seems to me that THERE metering separator plate is made out of cheap steel..
    it warps/bends/deforms from reverse gear pressure....

    Or they cheaped out and said fuck it just spot weld the duel feed plate to the metering plate,, call it good enough....

    thats why i asked? would puting another case plate under the transgo plate support it enough?

    the thicknes of 2 metering plates combined in that location...

    id have to use FULL plates so to keep everything flat and even acrost the trans case so it will seal..

    Or should i just use the oem plate drilled out to match the transgo plate holes and say screw the duel feed and not drill those holes.....

    I really dont want to tear it down again and do the duel feed the other way...... remove the center seal/remove the pump ring and plug the hole in the case......

    but i did do the 5 clutch drum in stead of 4 in the direct drum...

    the dude i got the piston from cut it perfect for clearances for the 5 clutch set up....

    edit: this is a pic of the trans go 1&2 kit i got,, it shows the dual feed plate on the metering plate,, it is spot welded to the plate...

    go.JPG

    the pics above are shots of the transfer dual feed slot,, the back side of the plate pics (above in other thread) shows where it is deformed, there is no support on the back side of the metering plate....
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
  14. Matt69olds

    Matt69olds Full Access Member

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    Did you punch the hole in the replacement valve body gasket? The gaskets included in the shift kits have one or 2 extra holes for the dual feed. It’s been a long time since I built one with a shift kit installed.
     

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