Transmission Options

[DoubleDingo]

Torque is the name of the game for pickups. That turbo'd 250 torque curve is flat, flat, flat. That would be an awesome setup. Now I want to find a 250.....

Torque is where it's at, but people want high rpm horsepower.

 

[Nonstop]

Throwing my BS opinion in here. Keep a 6 cylinder and 3 on the tree in there, BUT build up a 292 for it! If you are cruising it, then a torque engine is the way to go!

Okay, and throw at least a turbo on there.....

 

[jorlain]

Torque is where it's at, but people want high rpm horsepower.

Not for a truck application. This isn't a drag car. But when I'm building engines I have to consider the math as far as power:dollar. If you take all of that money you'd have to throw at a 250 or any small engine and put it towards anything with more displacement, you're going to make more power. A 350 makes 300+ ft lbs by basically sneezing on it and will fall into place. A 5.3 does it without any modification at all, but you need swap parts. A big block is... well, a big block. There's nothing better in the torque department.

 

[AuroraGirl]

I like being put in my seat more than raw hp to get smaller numbers in a 1/4.

But who says you cant have both?

 

[DoubleDingo]

Not for a truck application. This isn't a drag car. But when I'm building engines I have to consider the math as far as power:dollar. If you take all of that money you'd have to throw at a 250 or any small engine and put it towards anything with more displacement, you're going to make more power. A 350 makes 300+ ft lbs by basically sneezing on it and will fall into place. A 5.3 does it without any modification at all, but you need swap parts. A big block is... well, a big block. There's nothing better in the torque department.

I'm in a different mindset. Efficient power is better than anything. You can get any engine to produce efficient power. A mildly boosted 250 in a cruise truck would be a great choice. Big block is not going to be efficient, but it will produce lots of power. I'm against LS anything in a classic vehicle, so I stop my LS discussion there. Small blocks are great, they are easily modified for more power and efficiency. You could sell your 250 to @mcarlo86 and buy your LS or small block or big block.

Me being in a different mindset, I am taking out the 350 and going with a 292 in my '65. Bought it for $400, bought an extra head for it with the lump kit installed for $695, and getting the valves done on it now. The power increase with the lump kit and bigger valves is quite a difference on the dyno chart. Add a cam into the mix and you have a torque plane, not a torque curve. Yes the horsepower is not there, but the torque never lets up. So I'll be out about $1,500 when all is said and done and will have a nice torquey engine that will keep me planted in my seat and able to pull grades like nobody's business.

It's your truck, do with it what you will, just post pics in a build thread so we can see the progress.

 

[DoubleDingo]

Speaking of pics, where's the pics of this truck?

 

[jorlain]

I don't have any good pictures, but I can show you a couple along with the rust carnage that I'm working with.

The tailgate is going to keep it's patina. The doors and fenders will get replaced, along with the inner and outer rockers, floor pans, toe boards, and one cab corner. The firewall is rather perforated. I have another cab I'm going to use for patch panels for that. The box is in pretty good shape but needs a couple of dime size patches along with new (stainless) bed strips. The wood is weathered but still good. A light sanding and some varnish and they'll look nice.

I considered replacing the entire cab, but decided I wanted to keep as much of the original metal as I could and didn't want to fool around with the VIN, etc. I'm still considering reskinning the doors and patching the fenders but that's going to probably depend on whether I can find some decent take-offs or not. I'd rather not go with repops if I can help it.

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[DoubleDingo]

A little Flinstone action going on there, but a cool truck. Not many stepsides out there anymore.

 

[jorlain]

One neat thing I ran into with the tail gate; I thought the tailgate was a takeoff from another truck due to the color, but the inside is the same faded blue as the rest of the truck. Not sure why the outside looks like that (maybe it was just baking in the sun more), but the wife is absolutely smitten with how it looks and doesn't want me to paint it. Since its the first time she's ever taken an active interest in any of my projects, I figured I'd let her have her way.

 

[idahovette]

One neat thing I ran into with the tail gate; I thought the tailgate was a takeoff from another truck due to the color, but the inside is the same faded blue as the rest of the truck. Not sure why the outside looks like that (maybe it was just baking in the sun more), but the wife is absolutely smitten with how it looks and doesn't want me to paint it. Since its the first time she's ever taken an active interest in any of my projects, I figured I'd let her have her way.

GOOD CHOICE!!!!!!!

 

[DoubleDingo]

One neat thing I ran into with the tail gate; I thought the tailgate was a takeoff from another truck due to the color, but the inside is the same faded blue as the rest of the truck. Not sure why the outside looks like that (maybe it was just baking in the sun more), but the wife is absolutely smitten with how it looks and doesn't want me to paint it. Since its the first time she's ever taken an active interest in any of my projects, I figured I'd let her have her way.

Clear coat it for the win

 

[Nonstop]

Just food for thought - a lot of fleets used the straight 6’s. UPS was one of the biggest and used the 292s and Ford 300 6’s over the V8’s. They were well known torque engines and were reliable and relatively fuel efficient.

 

[jorlain]

I have no real experience to base this speculation on, but I would surmise that the low trim options and straight 6 engines have to do with overall cost. Cost on purchase, cost to maintain, and cost to insure. Most of the freight trucks around here run on natural gas or propane. Much cheaper than gasoline.

I don't have any experience with the GM straight 6 motors other than this one, but I've had a bunch of Ford 4.9s. I have zero bad things to say about them. Very reliable. But the 302/5.0 had better seat of the pants feel and similar fuel mileage in most cases in my experience.

 

[AuroraGirl]

I have no real experience to base this speculation on, but I would surmise that the low trim options and straight 6 engines have to do with overall cost. Cost on purchase, cost to maintain, and cost to insure. Most of the freight trucks around here run on natural gas or propane. Much cheaper than gasoline.

I don't have any experience with the GM straight 6 motors other than this one, but I've had a bunch of Ford 4.9s. I have zero bad things to say about them. Very reliable. But the 302/5.0 had better seat of the pants feel and similar fuel mileage in most cases in my experience.

302 and 300 in 96 were different beasts, a 300 was making its "low" power at 2k vs 302 at 4500+

 

[mcarlo86]

302 and 300 in 96 were different beasts, a 300 was making its "low" power at 2k vs 302 at 4500+

I have had both 300's and 302's in pickups. I'm not a big Ford guy, but the 300 I6 was a heck of a good engine. IMHO the 302 was the worst pickup engine I have ever been around. No bottom end power at all and terrible gas mileage. Alway had to have your foot in it. The 351 W was pretty decent though.