Oil pressure gauge reads low and knock on cold start in small block

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austinado16

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1990 Suburban with SBC....

Ever since buying our 'burb in 2004, with 225k on the original engine, the oil pressure has only readL

COLD: about a needle width past the 30psi mark during cold running, idle, or rev'd.

HOT: a needle with or so below the 30, idle and about on 30 hot at cruise speed (2,000rpm).

It's has always had a dull, *knock........knock.......knock..........knock* during initial cold start that goes away in about 1-2 seconds. Doesn't always do it cold, but usually. Might do it on a hot start, but that's pretty rare.

I've never trusted the gauge, figuring that if the oil pressure was really that low, it would have already grenaded, especially since we tow in the heat, and in the mountains with it. For example, 12hrs non-stop each way, to and from Grand Canyon, AZ to here in SoCal in triple digit heat for most of the way, towing a camper. Or the big slow pulls into and out of Kings Canyon Nat'l Park, where it's 25-30mph on twisty 2 lane at about 7% grade or better, for 30 minutes.....again, towing the camper and in the heat.

So it's at 276k now, still running strong. I replaced the oil pressure sender behind the dizzy, but that had no effect on the gauge, so I put the original back on.

I still haven't taken an oil pressure reading with a mechanical gauge, mainly because it's going to be a PIA to take the dizzy out, remove the sender, put the test gauge w/ hose in, and then take it all back apart in order to put it back to stock after the test.

Is there another test port somewhere? I was reading in the other current thread that there might be a sender on the oil filter housing? My truck has a factory engine oil cooler with it's big spacer block between the filter and the original filter housing, and 2 lines running to a huge cooler up in front of the a/c condensor. There is no sender in the oil filter area. There is one in the block, over about at the end of the starter, but I think that's a knock sensor, right?

So........what's causing the knock, and should I be concerned? The knock has never gotten any worse in the 50k we've put on it.

Should I pull the pan and take off all the rod caps and main caps and inspect bearings? Can I get the end-most main caps off? Should I replace the oil pump? If so, should I use an uprated one? More pressure version? More volume version? Brand of pump?

I always run synthetic 5w/30 and either an ACD filter, a K&N filter, or a NAPA WIX gold that is the bigger "industrial engine" version which is a big long filter.

If I do pop the pan off, what are the torque specs for the rods and mains?

Thanks!
 
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crazy4offroad

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With that many miles it sounds like it could be piston slap instead of a rod knock. 15 PSI @ idle warmed up is good so if you're just a hair under 30 you're ok. There is a place to connect the mechanical gauge down by the oil filter but I dont have a pic of the location. You will probably need a brass adapter fitting anyway.
 

HotRodPC

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It sounds like it's a tired motor. For sure one thing I'd quit doing, is quit the synthetic. I'd also go away from 5w-30. For an older motor like that, I'd run conventional oil and at least 10w40 or actually, probably just run SAE 30 in it. The thicker oil will help with oil pressure. IF you still want to run a higher quality oil, at least run with High Mileage blends.
 

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Also want to point out since you mention the long space between knock......knock..... etc, that tells me something too. It's possibly your knock is in the valvetrain and not the crank or rotating assembly. Reason I suggest this is, remember the cam only turns 1 time to the cranks 2 times. So if your motor is running at 1000rpms, you crank is turning 1000rpms, but the cam is only turning 500rpms, so lets say you have a loose rocker arm, it's going to knock half the time of say a rod bearing knocking. If its a knock..knock..knock its crank related, if its knock..........knock...........knock....... then it's valve train related. Hope that makes sense.
 

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crazy4offroad

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I got some really good pics of that area of the engine in this thread, I don't see any type of oil plug to tap into for a pressure test near the oil filter on TBI. Unless I missed it, please correct me if so...



http://www.gmsquarebody.com/forum/showthread.php?t=409&highlight=diverter&page=2

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89Suburban

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:waytogo:
 

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That you have pictured there and circled I do beleive is NOT an oil port. Its a bolt boss for Z bar clutch linkage.
 

crazy4offroad

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Hmmm you may be right. I may need to go out and snap a pic.
 

austinado16

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Thanks for the info guys.

The knock, is faster, sorry that my graphic showed it as slow. And it's a very low, inside the engine knock, as opposed to a lifter or rocker type of knock. I think it's mains, but it could be a rod. It's definately oil pressure related, and goes away in the time it would take to cancel an oil light, if youi know what I mean.

I've thought about going a little thicker on the oil, but was concerned that that might slow down initial oil pressure, and make the knock worse. Guess I could try 10w/40 and see what happens.

I'm probably just going to have to step up and put a T in at the sender, so I can tap into it with my mechanical test gauge and really see what's going on. I made a test gauge out of a grease gun whip hose, an NPT female/female coupler, and a 0-100 pressure gauge. The grease gun whip is threaded NPT, so hand tightened, it works in SAE and Metric threads, and is fine to leave in and drive around with. I just keep putting off doing it.
 

crazy4offroad

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Not a very good pic but this is where mine is:

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HotRodPC

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Yes, you should be able to tell if it's bottom end or upper end. So you're likely on the right track. You seem to be more than average on auto knowledge so I'd take your word for it, that it's low end. You can't complain though. If that is original motor, 275K + miles, those bearings have been good to you so far. If it's not smoking and the top end is till hanging in there, maybe pull the pan and put a set of bearings in it. It's a real PITA though. Sometimes easeir just to yank the motor to do it. Then you think, I've got it out, may as well rebuild the whole thing.
No need for me to say, you know that Burb is pretty in good shape and worth the expense of a new motor. Especially since you actually use it, and it seems to be a good fit for your family and you all like it alot. Skysurfer will tell you, he has a ton of money in his but you have to love it cuz it's sure not going to be worth what you have in it if you go to sell it.
 

HotRodPC

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Not a very good pic but this is where mine is:

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And you have Z bar linkage too. The threaded boss for the mount must be higher on the block then. I was also certain there was a oil pressure port near the filter. That one you have pictured doesn't look like it has a plug in it, so what keeps it from spewing oil out of it? :shrug:
 

HotRodPC

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It's got a sending unit in it it.

Not in the pic with the circle it don't but,

In the pic I did figure out where the Z bolt bosses are, and on this block they are not drilled and tapped. See the flat spot near the O2 sensor? That is where Z bolt boss goes and it's not tapped. The other one goes at the same height very near the back of the block and in this pic, the auto trans bell housing ear covers it up so it's not seen in the pic.
 

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