New kick down bracket install

[Raider L]

Well, I finally decided to put one of the two new kick down brackets in my truck today. The two brackets can be seen in "Wrong kick down rebuild" and the others about what I had bought, one bracket from Holley and the other one, a chrome one did come from Holley but it looks like something you'd get from Mr. Gasket Or TD Performance, or one of those kinds of companies. Holley owns all of them now because small companies can't make it in this economy so they get bought out. No matter, I used what I thought would work.

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Removed the factory brackets left over from the 2 bbl. carb I used to have on the motor. I wasn't concerned about using the kick down so I left it like it was. The throttle worked okay so I left that to. But since my trans has just been overhauled I figured this is a good time to correct the brackets so they fit the 4 bbl. carb setup.

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This is the real Holley bracket, see pics in "Wrong kick down rebuild". It would not place the kick down cable where it actually needed to be. To bad because I really liked the looks of this one. But I couldn't reattach the throttle cable with this bracket on so I had to put the chrome one on that has provisions for both the throttle cable and the kick down cable.

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As you can see it attaches to the back corner bolt on the carb base plate. The bracket is made in such a way where it has flanges turned down and is squared up on the carb base where it won't go anywhere so the one nut is all it needs. I don't really like that because both cables pulling against this one nut doesn't seem to be very secure, but it's design seems okay. We'll see how it works in the long run.

Another view of the install. I don't have my kick down hooked up yet because I discovered that the bolt/stud-slider thing the kick down cable attaches to, the bolt end was the wrong size diameter to go through the hole on the carb linkage. So I spent the next 2 1/2 hours looking through every single fastener I have trying to find another stud thing to fit the kick down cable on, and didn't have another one that was that small to fit the hole in the carb linkage.

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So I finally came up with an aircraft bolt to go in the linkage until I get the correct one from Holley. Dang that made me so frustrated. I had two extra throttle linkage studs, but not anything legit I could use except a dang bolt! Sorry guys, and gals. I did put forth max effort to find the right thing so I can be a good example to the young guys and gals looking how to work on our Squares the right way, and not half a** engineering. You know what I mean?

 

[Raider L]

Here's a couple of other pics that include the other view I mention above.

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Here's that "another view" mentioned in the first set of pics. The chrome bracket has this little arm hanging straight down behind where the throttle cable anchor end goes into the square hole for it. It has a couple of holes in it for the spring hook up, one large hole, and one small hole, I used the large hole for the spring end wire. In this pic I was still looking for something to attach the kick down cable.

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I was looking at the throttle bracket and it looked a little to close so I moved it back. Both the throttle bracket and the kick down brackets are adjustable. There are 2, #10-32 phillips screws with 11/32" nuts on the back.
And that temporary bolt holding the kick down cable.

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You experts.....does that look "normal" for where the kick down cable should be at rest? You guys, gals have been so helpful and patient, it's embarrassing to even ask about something so mundane.

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[SirRobyn0]

I'd hardly call myself an expert on brackets, but to me they look fine, the angles may not be perfect but certainly close enough. I will say this though, I'm yet to find an aftermarket bracket set that I actually like. I have seen the carb post brackets like yours move. See there where it's bolted to the carb, there is a little tab that sticks down. It doesn't look like it's against the carb in the picture and it will be shortly, cause it'll move. When it does that your cables will obviously loosen some and the angles will change some.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

Yeah, that's what I was talking about above. I don't like the slop, but you know they make these things to fit "universally". I to have used a lot of after market stuff over the years and I've learned whenever you see the word "universal" you have two choices, one, don't get it 'cause it's going to not fit like a factory one, and two, you can go ahead and use it and just rig it the best you can.

That corner setup, I don't really know what I could do to take up that little extra slop, maybe put a little larger washer under the bracket? But then I'm doing just what you were saying, I'm having to rig it to fit. Or cut a piece of Aluminum and fashion it to fill that space? I adjusted the cables back a bit more than they needed to be so just as you see, when it moves the cable placement won't affect how things work. I did turn that bracket at the corner just to see exactly how much it is going to move, and it wasn't that much. I just thought of what I could do and that is cut out a piece of '050" Alum. in a "L" shape and put it around that corner and that will stop it from moving.

Can you think of any other brackets like these? Unfortunately Holley didn't have a combo bracket using the one I show in the pic above and one for the throttle cable to. Besides the one I tried didn't place the kick down in the right place. It was still to far away to be adjusted right.

 

[Raider L]

People!! I've found the correct kick down stud for the Holley 1450- 1850-2 600 cfm. 4 bbl. carb.!! ( probably others as well including Q-Jets, although their kickdown hole in the linkage may be larger, but not the Holley) If anyone is currently looking for this part, here's how you find it.

Go to Jegs and type in "p/n 8009 cable stud" When the page pulls up the stud shown is not it. You scroll down the page until you see, "Customers who viewed this item also viewed". and a row of different studs will appear. In those items you will see "Jegs Transmission Linkage kickdown stud 3/16" diam. 1/4"-28 x 5/8" thread" The p/n is 555-157202. This is the correct part for the kickdown stud!

I ordered it. The only bad thing is Jegs is charging $10.99 shipping for this little screw! That sucks but when you figure that's the only way of getting the right one that even Holley doesn't show on their site. I'll go to Holley and type in some of the part number here and see what comes up. If I have a spare hour I'll try to call them, (have you ever called Holley? Forget it. They have to call you back when it's your turn!), and see if they have this screw and ask them why this stud isn't included in the box with my carb! The larger stud is included and I don't loose things like this. I have a special plastic parts box I keep this kind of stuff in and I looked. The only thing that is included with the carb is a bunch of different throttle studs but no extra kickdown studs.

*If I knew how to "cut and paste", or whatever you do to get a picture over here, I would have included the photo of it off the Jegs site. Sorry, old and behind the curve.

 

[Raider L]

I drove the truck tonight, 7:00 pm, and I noticed right off that the gas peddle felt real easy to push down like there wasn't much pressure from the springs holding the throttle back. It seems that attaching the throttle springs on the carb, where they've always been but attaching the other ends on the little arm of the new throttle bracket was a shorter distance than what it's always been. I'm used to that feel, not real easy like it is now. I may try and find another place to attach them so it feels more like it did.
Or I can make a bracket just to attach the springs to. I can do that, I did it all the time when I was a aircraft mechanic, we were always coming up with stuff to make things work but of course going by the FAR-43 which is the FAA procedure book for making things and putting them in a passenger plane that aren't factory, or has all the government paperwork behind it. It tells you what you can do "in the field" and what you can't. So I'll be going by that, not the actual book but the spirit of it, when I design something so it'll be sturdy and won't fail. I have some super strong steel sheet metal I can cut it from.

 

[SirRobyn0]

I want you to know I've seen your posts and followed your updates, I just haven't had time to make a proper post.

Cool find on that kick down stud.

I've tried a bunch of different "universal" brackets on installs I've done. I've gotten to the point that I make the brackets from scratch now at the shop. I use to use some parts from a kit, and I'd cut the factory bracket and weld / bolt parts of the kit to the factory bracket, which is what I have on my truck and was the last one I did like that (sorry no pic handy, I'll try to remember to take one in the morning). Now I just cut up the factory bracket and rearticulate adding metal as needed. Weld it up and paint it. Keeps the bracket on the manifold like from the factory.

you could also get shorter return springs at a parts store if you don't want to build. If you do make something I hope you'll post pictures.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

I'm a experienced welder and designer of all kinds of aircraft fixtures, tools, and jigs, including rolling work stands, rolling multi light fixtures, rolling work platforms for working on and around very large multi tubo prop aircraft, and all kinds of holding fixtures and jigs for overhauling aircraft parts like huge landing gear and eleven foot diameter propeller storage stands holding up to four props. I've designed tools and made copies of tools of factory tools that our airline was to...well let's just say the factory wanted a fortune to sell us any of them.
I got a real joy out of being given full creative license to make anything I could to help the airline save money. I made so much stuff that didn't exist before and copies of stuff that was only found in the factory, I finally made a photo album of many of my creations and builds. Literally guys would bring me a sketch of some idea they had on a scrap piece of paper wondering if I could make it and two days later this tool or thing was sitting on their toolbox.
I'd roll these huge elevated work stands out of my shop made out of 1" square steel tubing that two or three guys could work off of, on wheels and lights the guys could use inside or outside the hanger day or night, the aircraft maint. shop ran 24 hrs. a day, to work on and they would just be astonished. Nobody asked for it, heck they were using ladders way up off the ground, twelve feet to work on the tail, and to work on the engines, one guy at a time. I saw a need, and mostly for safety and a better place to work from, and built what the shop needed to do a better job.

I'm not bragging, I'm like you, I just wish I had access to a shop that wasn't a million miles away where I could make my own stuff. Looking at that factory bracketry I took off my engine that was the first thing in my mind was, "Well, I could cut this off move it over here, make a thing here and then it would be just like it needs to be." Then reality sets in and I know I can't make stuff like I used to. But I do have a small Oxygen/Mapp gas torch set up and a lot of small steel sheet pieces but I'd have to Braze them together, and aluminum sheet I could pop rivet together and with some time I could probably make something myself. But Man, to have a T.I.G. welder, heck even one from Harbor Freight would be great. But then I'd need a tank of Argon and a radiator, cups and collets , cleaners, etc.. I still have all my tools and TIG electrods and a whole box of TIG stuff I used to use when I worked for the airlines. Does your TIG have a radiator? It circulates water through the torch handle to keep it cool while welding. The TIG machines at Harbor Freight even have foot peddles. Got to have a foot peddle.

 

[SirRobyn0]

@SirRobyn0,

I'm a experienced welder and designer of all kinds of aircraft fixtures, tools, and jigs, including rolling work stands, rolling multi light fixtures, rolling work platforms for working on and around very large multi tubo prop aircraft, and all kinds of holding fixtures and jigs for overhauling aircraft parts like huge landing gear and eleven foot diameter propeller storage stands holding up to four props. I've designed tools and made copies of tools of factory tools that our airline was to...well let's just say the factory wanted a fortune to sell us any of them.
I got a real joy out of being given full creative license to make anything I could to help the airline save money. I made so much stuff that didn't exist before and copies of stuff that was only found in the factory, I finally made a photo album of many of my creations and builds. Literally guys would bring me a sketch of some idea they had on a scrap piece of paper wondering if I could make it and two days later this tool or thing was sitting on their toolbox.
I'd roll these huge elevated work stands out of my shop made out of 1" square steel tubing that two or three guys could work off of, on wheels and lights the guys could use inside or outside the hanger day or night, the aircraft maint. shop ran 24 hrs. a day, to work on and they would just be astonished. Nobody asked for it, heck they were using ladders way up off the ground, twelve feet to work on the tail, and to work on the engines, one guy at a time. I saw a need, and mostly for safety and a better place to work from, and built what the shop needed to do a better job.

I'm not bragging, I'm like you, I just wish I had access to a shop that wasn't a million miles away where I could make my own stuff. Looking at that factory bracketry I took off my engine that was the first thing in my mind was, "Well, I could cut this off move it over here, make a thing here and then it would be just like it needs to be." Then reality sets in and I know I can't make stuff like I used to. But I do have a small Oxygen/Mapp gas torch set up and a lot of small steel sheet pieces but I'd have to Braze them together, and aluminum sheet I could pop rivet together and with some time I could probably make something myself. But Man, to have a T.I.G. welder, heck even one from Harbor Freight would be great. But then I'd need a tank of Argon and a radiator, cups and collets , cleaners, etc.. I still have all my tools and TIG electrods and a whole box of TIG stuff I used to use when I worked for the airlines. Does your TIG have a radiator? It circulates water through the torch handle to keep it cool while welding. The TIG machines at Harbor Freight even have foot peddles. Got to have a foot peddle.

No radiator on the TIG welder at the shop. At home / farm I just have the basic $100 harbor freight wire feed unit that I've had for years, it feeds the wire at an uneven rate, but none the less I can put metal together with it and have made countless welds on the farm with it. I do not have the fab experience or abilities you do that's for sure, I can made stuff but it often isn't the prettiest. I usually will only do fab stuff at work for small stuff, like brackets when nothing else is available.

I enjoyed reading your story. As you know I'm in automotive, or as I often put it my day job, but for me most of it isn't fun anymore. I enjoy my square and I often enjoy working on it, and I do enjoy sharing knowledge especially with the old squares, hence the reason I'm on this forum. But as far as fixing anything built in the last 20 years. Forget it. It's just miserable to me. My body no longer allows me to do as much as I use to so I spend a lot more time at the desk at the shop than I use to which is fine. Mostly the only time I turn a wrench at the shop these days is on the classics / older rigs or if the guys are overwhelmed with work. I did not get into automotive to work on the cars built today or to sit at a desk but here I am doing just that, at least for now. If I'm honest I'm a little envious of folks that can make a long term living at something they truly enjoy.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

Yes, I'm looking at it now and am going to move that spring. I noticed the way this new bracket is made the hole for the spring back at the part of the throttle cable where it locks into the bracket actually puts that end of the springs a little to close to the cable for my liking. So I plan on moving it as soon as I can take the time from needed yard work to climb back into my engine compartment to look at it again. I'm telling you, I don't know what I'd do if I had to lean over the engine from outside the truck to get to stuff. In my shape, not fat just gimped up, I couldn't do it.

Have you ever seen those work stands that you climb up and lay down on a little platform over the engine? Well, that may be fine for some people but it's a stupid idea if you ask me.
I still get looks from passers by and they see me sitting inside of my engine compartment working on the motor. One guy stopped and said, "Wow man, you could stand on the ground next to the motor in this thing." It was funny.

I found a old dentists stand they used to use, next to the person, and put their tools and filling stuff on. I made a nice wood platform to go on it out of maple and fashioned a thick wood lip and glued it around the edge so things wouldn't roll off. You loosen a knob half way down on the down leg and you can raise the platform up and down. It has two little wheels on the front. I'll take a pic of it. I roll it under the front of the truck and I can put tools and some small parts on it as I work.
It might give you an idea and maybe make one for yourself. It saves your back from having to be bending over to look for tools, a wrench or socket. It's all right there next to you with this stand.

 

[SirRobyn0]

@SirRobyn0,

Yes, I'm looking at it now and am going to move that spring. I noticed the way this new bracket is made the hole for the spring back at the part of the throttle cable where it locks into the bracket actually puts that end of the springs a little to close to the cable for my liking. So I plan on moving it as soon as I can take the time from needed yard work to climb back into my engine compartment to look at it again. I'm telling you, I don't know what I'd do if I had to lean over the engine from outside the truck to get to stuff. In my shape, not fat just gimped up, I couldn't do it.

Have you ever seen those work stands that you climb up and lay down on a little platform over the engine? Well, that may be fine for some people but it's a stupid idea if you ask me.
I still get looks from passers by and they see me sitting inside of my engine compartment working on the motor. One guy stopped and said, "Wow man, you could stand on the ground next to the motor in this thing." It was funny.

I found a old dentists stand they used to use, next to the person, and put their tools and filling stuff on. I made a nice wood platform to go on it out of maple and fashioned a thick wood lip and glued it around the edge so things wouldn't roll off. You loosen a knob half way down on the down leg and you can raise the platform up and down. It has two little wheels on the front. I'll take a pic of it. I roll it under the front of the truck and I can put tools and some small parts on it as I work.
It might give you an idea and maybe make one for yourself. It saves your back from having to be bending over to look for tools, a wrench or socket. It's all right there next to you with this stand.

I like that dentist tool stand idea.

A co-worker a few years ago had one of those lay on platform things your talking about. His was called a sky-creaper or something like that. I used it a few times but I'd never buy one. It's great for doing the back plugs on new Ford pickups where the engine is burried so far under the cowling that reaching them by laying down and stretching out your arms is easier than trying to articulate your arms in there any other way. But I don't do well laying on my stomach for very long as it'll make me hurt like crazy. Besides having some health issue I am fat, and laying on the stuff is not comfortable at all. Yes I sit in my engine compartment for some stuff to so your not the only one doing that lol.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

Here's the pics of that dental stand I use. I tried to take a pic of the measuring tape so you could see how long the tubing is but some of the pics a blurred. I'll indicate what the number is in the particular pic as the pics go along.

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The old top was trash so I made my own out of plywood and attached it with plumbing/electrical pipe hanger things. The metal frame under the wood is part of the stand, I didn't make that. It's like flat bar, 3/8" X 1/8". I've seen it at Lowe's.

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I used maple sheet as thick as you see this is and maked out the shape I wanted especially the corners and cut them out with a jig saw.

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This is the adjustment knob. You loosen it and slide the inner tube up and down and the platform will swivel obviously as well. So position is unlimited.

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Pretty much what you want for a wheel, it's a swivel wheel.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

More pics.

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This bend is made so when the stand is sitting on the floor, depending on the size of the wheel the stand will be level.

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See?

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Here's how I use it. I climb in the engine compartment and and I can reach over and get what I need. This thing is really strong. I had my intake manifold on it, carb., and the tray out of my tool box full of wrenches and it wasn't bending down at all.

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Or to the side if I'm working on the side in the compartment.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

More pics.

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This bend is made so when the stand is sitting on the floor, depending on the size of the wheel the stand will be level.

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See?

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Here's how I use it. I climb in the engine compartment and and I can reach over and get what I need.

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Or to the side if I'm working on the side in the compartment.

 

[Raider L]

@SirRobyn0,

Dang I was afraid I double clicked it!! Anyway Here's some measurements.

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From the center of the bend of the tube across the bottom of the platform, 18 7/8" to end of the tube. I think the platform length is the longer number here, probably 20". You can also see those pipe clamps I used to attach the platform to that ring. We've seen those. I think you can get them from Lowe's.

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This is the tube with the clamping knob on it, 19" long from the where that tube attaches to the tube with the wheels on it. I think the inside diam. is 1 1/16"

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The platform is 14 1/4" wide

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From the center of the bend, of the tube that slides inside the base tube, and this is the tube that runs across the bottom of the platform is 24 1/2" to the end of the tube. I think it measured 1" in diam.. It's close enough so that it just slides inside the tube with the knob on it. Sometimes you have to order that size of tubing that just slides inside another.