Working over a motor

[Dutch Rutter]

Hello everyone.

Started working over my motor that I built years ago. High nickle 4 bolt main. Its become a lot of learning to see what mistakes I mad during that build up so I'm hoping for some insight on how I can build this thing back up for my truck.

So far, It has an Edelbrock RPM performer, Edelbrock 1406, Pro Comp PC3001-0606-0026 aluminum cylinder heads which measure out to 64cc/190cc I had the valve seats replaced and the springs setup properly for a flat tappet setup. I am fairly certain we had the block honed a little over to get scuffing out of the cylinders, I believe dished pistons. If I recall correctly we put in a Edelbrock performer cam, I'll be checking this out a little bit more as I get into it.

My first thoughts of going through this motor was to replace old external gaskets and seals, replace the oil pump, rear main, replace the balancer and put a timing mark on it so I can actually time the thing with a light, and check bearings and cylinder walls with hopes of them being just fine. If I can get the info off my cam and maybe pickup some more performance by changing it out with something else I may do that as well.

I am by no means an expert engine builder, and really don't know a lot of the specifies to things so I'm looking for some info on these things, is this a decent start so far?

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[DoubleDingo]

That seems legit. We rebuilt an engine in '85 of unknown mileage. Plastigauged the mains and rods, checked the cylinder bores, reused the internals, cut the ridge, hot tanked it, honed the bores of the cylinders and lifters, new bearings and seals, and ran it. I pulled the heads off in '96 to have them re-worked, and there was no ridge on the cylinders that time around and that was after 194k. That engine never burned oil, never used oil, and just ran great, and it was never babied by any means.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

That seems legit. We rebuilt an engine in '85 of unknown mileage. Plastigauged the mains and rods, checked the cylinder bores, reused the internals, cut the ridge, hot tanked it, honed the bores of the cylinders and lifters, new bearings and seals, and ran it. I pulled the heads off in '96 to have them re-worked, and there was no ridge on the cylinders that time around and that was after 194k. That engine never burned oil, never used oil, and just ran great, and it was never babied by any means.

Great news for me. When we first built it we went through everything with a fine toothed comb, but I don't think we paid much attention to what parts we were putting into it. And didn't really have a goal for it other then it to start up. After it was running it maybe got 40k miles put onto it. She doesn't look pretty right now by any stretch but its also been sitting for a few years so I'll give it a good cleaning and good prep before throwing Chevy orange back on it, and if I have to replace some more internals due to wear or to gain some more efficiency out of it, so be it. The motor it will be replacing is still working, its just slow and getting tired.

Going to get a compression test done on each cylinder this weekend, pull the balancer, timing cover and pan. I'll also check the timing set, and bearings. Hopefully I'll find some numbers on that cam to get a better idea of whats in there. but all in all should turn out very well in a few weeks, and should be able to get it in before the end of May (if all things go smoothly)

 

[mtnmankev]

To save you a few bucks, you can most likely save your oil pump, they RARELY wear out or go bad.
And don't use the nylon oil pump bushing, get the hardened steel one with shaft that goes to the distributor.
Well worth the five bucks I paid for mine at the machine shop.
At 40K miles you may also get lucky and the timing chain still be nice and tight.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

I got around to digging more into the motor today. Found that my main bearings should be replaced (seeing some copper coloring through) which means I might as well do rod bearings, and at that point everything... So my quick warm over is looking like a full overhaul.

the timing set was tight and could have worked but at this point its just another $40.00 so I'll end up stripping her down completely, and plan on taking the block and heads into a machine shop to get the full treatment.

What are some suggestions for a cam to put into this thing? I reached out to Lunati for a suggestion but curious as to what everyone here thinks. keeping it hydro flat tappet. Would like some thumpity thump at idle and performance to match these heads, but it is still a daily driver which does tow and go offroad.

 

[DirtyDYT]

...but it is still a daily driver which does tow and go offroad.

I’d settle for a mild truck or RV cam based on that last sentence. They can still sound great with the right exhaust note and give plenty of torque down low. Problem with a more aggressive cam is that you’re sacrificing low end and mid band torque for high end power which is not what I’d want for a DD.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

I’d settle for a mild truck or RV cam based on that last sentence. They can still sound great with the right exhaust note and give plenty of torque down low. Problem with a more aggressive cam is that you’re sacrificing low end and mid band torque for high end power which is not what I’d want for a DD.

That makes a lot of sense to me. Which would also mean that I could keep my current cam which is in fantastic shape and the lifters look good as new. I got it all pulled apart and the only thing I am finding concerning is the bearings. I'll jump to the mobile and post the pictures up.

 

[DoubleDingo]

Yes, torque.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

Everything is in order

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^ Left top is first rod bearing. On the right side is main cap bearings

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^ of course the other side of the rod bearings, bottom right is #2 piston

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^ mains look decent I think

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^ cam looks and feels great, Crank is smooth and no burrs

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^ no idea what is with all the black soot, but might be normal

Is there something that I am missing? or anyone have any insight to the bearing wear I am seeing? Maybe my crank needs to go into the machine shop is my thinking.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

In an effort to keep this post current here is a small update.

I dropped everything off at the machine shop last Friday. After the initial inspection of the parts the shop operator said that everything looked pretty decent except for the main bearing wear, which was probably caused by too tight of tolerances for the rods to the crank. And it looks as though only #3 was having detonation issues as the rod bearing went egg shaped.

So Hes going to clean everything up for me, give the block a hone, inspect everything and give me a call later this week. Most likely I am looking to have the large rod ends bored slightly and will have to go with a .09 over rod bearing instead of the .10 bearings that got toasted on my .10 crank. He'll also be installing new cam bearings, freeze plugs and who knows what else it'll need at this point, but I don't expect too much in lines of work needed.

Once that is all said and done I have a lot of new parts sitting in my cart waiting to be ordered for the reassembly. I will most likely be keeping the current cam which is an RV2 as long as it inspects out fine along with the crank itself.

 

[shiftpro]

You don't have the best intake for your torque needs... just saying. It obviously will work but I'm thinking there must be some torque sacrificed for high rpm flow..

 

[Dutch Rutter]

You don't have the best intake for your torque needs... just saying. It obviously will work but I'm thinking there must be some torque sacrificed for high rpm flow..

Gotcha, so what would be a better intake for this setup? This Edelbrock 7101 (correction to PN) is mainly just what I've had on it, and what had the same port size as the heads when we initially bought it. But I am completely open to changing things around for it to fit the bill better.

 

[shiftpro]

Gotcha, so what would be a better intake for this setup? This Edelbrock 7101 (correction to PN) is mainly just what I've had on it, and what had the same port size as the heads when we initially bought it. But I am completely open to changing things around for it to fit the bill better.

For example the non-RPM model, #2701, is rated from idle to 5500rpm. Yours, the 7101, prefers 1500 to 6500 rpm.

And it's cheap $150...
https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/edl-2701/overview/?rrec=true

There might be an Air-Gap model of this intake...? It might be a better design, it's certainly newer.

Hopefully someone else here will chime in with more info/experience with these parts. It might not be a worthwhile upgrade...
but then again, it would one less part to clean.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

That's some good info, I was unaware of the RPM ratings on those. I really do enjoy the less cleaning part because this thing has been kicking my butt. We used a punch and dimpled the ends in hopes of getting a better seal.. it sure worked but makes cleaning difficult.

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[shiftpro]

That's some good info, I was unaware of the RPM ratings on those. I really do enjoy the less cleaning part because this thing has been kicking my butt. We used a punch and dimpled the ends in hopes of getting a better seal.. it sure worked but makes cleaning difficult.

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Whichever intake you use, I would only use Permatex Right Stuff on the front and rear and nada on the actual gaskets. Dry fit the intake to see how big the
gap is, front and rear, and if it's 1/8" or more, run a bead of Right stuff on the block and let it set up, then another along side and on top before you set the intake down.