Issues with Ignition 83 K30...HELP?!

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MetalStretcher

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So awhile back I was driving and i didnt push the gas fast enough when I was coming off the clutch and the truck died. When I went to re start the truck I got nothing. Also I couldn't get the key to turn the ignition to the off position. Key comes out just fine.

I am in the process of installing a new ignition cylinder, but the new one is doing the same thing. I can get accessory, and fuel, but no start or lock.

I've pulled the column down and pulled the ignition switch out of the way and I see the rod with a hook that moves towards and away from the driver. When I push and pull on that its doing the same thing. Only getting two out of four positions....Any help?

I may be completely off track here, this truck is my first endeavor at doing all my own work. I've attached a picture of the situation I'm facing. My finger is behind the rod I am talking about. Could it be the ignition switch its self? I bought one, but im thinking thats not it because with the current one out of the way the rod still is not moving freely.

Thanks.
 

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Ricko1966

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Take the electrical portion off the column 2 screws I think they are 5/16 heads,it's been a while then you can work the switch through its whole range of functions with a small screwdriver. If it hits and functions in all positions,which I think it will. You probably need a new rack that moves the rod.
 

CalSgt

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Take the electrical portion off the column 2 screws I think they are 5/16 heads,it's been a while then you can work the switch through its whole range of functions with a small screwdriver. If it hits and functions in all positions,which I think it will. You probably need a new rack that moves the rod.
^^^^This

But I will also add the ignition switch can be worn where you can start it with a tool but the rod can’t push that far. As the switch is going out we end up pressing harder and harder on the lock cylinder to get it to crank.

I think I broke my ignition cylinder rack by using my thumb to assist the rod while turning the key to the start position when my switch started to go out.

If you have a tilt column and end up tearing it down far enough to replace the ignition rack I recommend ensuring that the column bolts are good and tight while in there. You’ll know if they need it if you can wobble the column up and down. I suspect the wobble can stress the rack too.

I had a hard time finding just the rack and ended up buying a kit from Summit

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/SMP-US165L

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Here’s the 4 tilt column bolts, I decided to use loctite on them this time since it’s a PIA to get back in there to snug them when they get loose.

You must be registered for see images attach

The other thing to consider checking is the neutral safety, especially since you dropped the column it can get knocked out of alignment or be worn out.
 

CalSgt

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FYI whatever you do don’t bend that rod…. It’s a perfect delicate fit when installed correctly. When they get tweaked they can and will bind in the column.
 

mshawn

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This is so common! Back in the 80s and 90s on to the 2000s I had more of these pulled in for this problem and yes the rack is broken. I hope this helps to confirm what others have said here.
 

MetalStretcher

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Okay, I'm having trouble finding a video that shows where in the column the rack is and how to tear down to get to it. Ive got the steering wheel off and column bolts off so it drops.

Any help?
 
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MetalStretcher

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The other thing to consider checking is the neutral safety, especially since you dropped the column it can get knocked out of alignment or be worn out.
Would this apply to a manual transmission? I thought only automatics had neutral safety switches? My truck doesnt have the E-Brake hooked up so it always sits in gear...if that matters.
 

CalSgt

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Would this apply to a manual transmission? I thought only automatics had neutral safety switches? My truck doesnt have the E-Brake hooked up so it always sits in gear...if that matters.
Manual still has a safety switch IIRC... Just not the same one as automatics use, I believe there would be a switch in the transmission and/or one on the clutch pedal. Some vehicles have a bypass button on the dash too but my square didn't.

Okay, I'm having trouble finding a video that shows where in the column the rack is and how to tear down to get to it. Ive got the steering wheel off and column bolts off so it drops.

Any help?
Do you have a tilt column or a non-tilt? Either way it is on the opposite side of the column from the ignition lock cylinder.

This is an involved job, keep organized and take pictures as you go to assist with re-assembly. Muffin tins and or magnet trays are great for holding all of your pieces as you go.

Here's how I did it with tilt column, a non tilt is probably similar and simpler:

Tools:
13/16 socket for steering wheel nut
steering wheel puller (maybe, sometimes you can just pull them with your hands)
pick for removing lock plate spring clip (pocket knife, small screwdrivers, etc. can also be used)
small pick with 90* bend for de-pinning turn signal switch connector (small stiff wire or paperclip can work too)
Phillips screwdriver
medium/large blade screwdriver - for tilt spring
something that fits the flats on the tilt lever - tiny wrench or adjustable wrench, pliers work too but can mar the lever
a few small sockets with an extension and ratchet (1/4" drive is enough)
E-Torx socket (female torx/star socket) for tilt column base bolts (cant remember the size though)
Lock plate compression tool and tilt pin removal tool (can be done without but requires ingenuity, luck, and maybe skill)
small hammer (or a big one)
small punch (for automatic shift lever)
Muffin pan or magnetic tray for bolts and hardware
Junk towel or sheet to cover your seat with if its nice, the inside of the column can be nasty & greasy
Lube - something thicker than WD-40 and thinner than high temp bearing grease, bearing grease is probably fine if it doesn't get freezing cold where you're at. I mix a little motor oil & grease together sometimes to make a lighter thinner grease, also just tried some Lucas Red & Tacky Spray grease that seems nice.

Remove steering wheel
remove the turn lock plate - lock ring (circlip) on the shaft, need someone to compress the spring by pushing the plate down while you remove the snap ring or you could buy the tool)
remove turn cancel cam/horn button contact and the spring below it
remove turn signal lever
remove hazard flasher knob

I'm not sure it is possible to break down the column far enough to replace the rack without removing the turn signal switch.
You may be able to remove turn signal switch screws and wiggle enough slack into the wires, probably need to unplug turn switch harness at lower column. Its such a hectic job I recommend just removing the whole switch & harness.

to remove switch -
If turn switch is broke and being replaced, just clip the wires at the switch and leave the wires in place, you will use them to pull the new harness in during assembly.
If re-using the turn switch de-pin the harness connector at the lower column (record wire colors/positions or take a good picture first) and pull it out. When you remove it, use the wires to pull a dummy wire in so you have a tool to pull everything back through the column for re-install.

remove lock cylinder - one screw then may have a detent or something to push on and wiggle it out. Mine needed to be in the run position to be removed IIRC.
remove the gear selector (for automatics) Just drive the pin out and wiggle the shifter out feel the shifter spring to see if it will come out, if not just leave it.
remove tilt lever (just threaded in)
shroud should be able to come off at this point

Once you remove the plastic shroud
To remove the rack the tilt pin needs to be removed because the pin goes through the center of the rack, I'm not sure if it can be replaced while tilt mechanism is still attached to the column but might be worth a try.

Here's where it is on a tilt (its the part that says Kipp):
img_8526-jpg.288177


To remove the tilt mechanism:
remove the horn contact/lock plate tension spring from the shaft
remove the bearing race and the other piece the spring presses on from the shaft
re-insert the tilt lever
tilt the column fully one way to relieve tilt spring tension
remove tilt spring - its a round plug with square hole, use a large blade screwdriver to depress the plug and turn CCW about 1/4 turn and remove plug and spring.
remove tilt pins - special pin puller tool sold for this (We just threaded a bolt in them and used a slide hammer)
remove the tilt mechanism - Depress the tilt lever fully and wiggle the assembly off of the steering shaft, you are wiggling the rack loose from the ign. switch rod and the tilt locks loose from their locator pins.
Caution: the steering shaft ball bearings in the tilt mechanism are retained by a plastic bearing cage and they can easily be knocked out after it's removed from the shaft.

To remove the rack:
remove the anti theft plate - just wiggle it around until it lifts out easily
Remove the steering lock plunger spring - remove the screw and rotate the spring away from the column
Remove the rack - just pull it out from the bottom.

Check tilt base bolts for tightness & I recommend loctite while you are this deep into it.

Lube:
Ign. switch rod where it rides in its notch
new rack where it makes contact with the rod
tension spring that pushes rack against the pinion (just a thin sheet metal spring clipped into the housing)
pinion teeth
and anything else you feel like - shaft bearings, tilt spring, tilt locks etc.

Install new rack:
insert it from the bottom lining up the big lug on the pinion with the big notch in the rack

Position the rack so it is as far down as possible without falling out or getting out of alignment with the pinion
Position the Ign. switch rod so it is as high up on the column as possible. Since your switch is already disconnected you may be able to pull it up a little further just don't bend it.

Depress tilt lever fully and carefully reassemble the tilt mechanism to the column while getting the rack to engage the Ign switch rod AND the tilt locks on their pins. Took me three attempts.

If everything looks right, partially insert and tap the hinge pins far enough to hold it together. Test the operation of the rack by using the ign. lock cylinder. Test in all tilt positions, if satisfied tap the pins flush and reassemble everything in reverse order.


ETA:
Once the rack is in place do not turn the pinion too far or it will jump out of time resulting in the large lug not lining up with the notch on the rack. This will prevent you from being able to turn the key fully off, and may result in it not having enough throw to move into the start position.

The Ign. switch will need to be adjusted once everything is back together, have someone turn the key to the start position while you slide the Ign switch a little closer and tighten it down. This will add a little extra spring tension on the cylinder when its in the start position which gives it a little extra umph to snap back to the run position, this helps overcome some bind on the Ign switch rod or in the rack/pinion or lock cylinder. I recommend cycling the key to all positions really gently several times to feel/hear each function of the switch. I didn't have enough extra tension on mine & it would hang up between start and run when letting off of the key, now it snaps back to the run position after start.
 
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SquareRoot

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The Neutral safety Switch is underneath the column near the dash. It's white plastic and has a self adjusting arm that attaches to the clutch pedal arm. Should have a two-prong plug like a brake light switch.
I put all new in my 85 when I converted from slushbox to manual. I hated the function of it so bad, I bypassed it. I know, people will rant about safety but so be it.
 

MetalStretcher

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Thanks so much. This helps alot. Going to tackle tomorrow. And I do have a tilt column. Ive got her torn down to where the turn signal cam are out, so can pick up on your instructions from there.

Thanks as well on the Safety switch, will also check into that.
 

Snoots

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I wish I had known this about 5 years ago! Wound up replacing both the upper and lower bearings after smothering them in axle grease.
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And like @CalSgt said, use lock-tite on the tilt mechanism bolts.

Caution: the steering shaft ball bearings in the tilt mechanism are retained by a plastic bearing cage and they can easily be knocked out after it's removed from the shaft.
 

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