Rebuilt 350 - Abysmal Fuel Econ

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Skweegle89

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Pretty much straight up and down open with it unhooked. I will hook it back up in a few and see what's happening.


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rich weyand

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Unhooked? As in just flapping there? What's to keep it from getting sucked shut by engine vacuum? I'm trying to remember where the pivots are. Probably get sucked open.
 

Skweegle89

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No unhooked as in the green wire is not connected to the choke, although it is pretty loose. I can open and shut it by moving it, but it pops back open.


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MadOgre

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MadOgre and I disagree on ignition timing. The street rod guys all tell me to advance it until it knocks under load, like punching it from stop up a steep hill, then back off two degrees. I was running 16-18* BTDC on the completely stock engine in my truck before I changed the engine out and it loved it. Chevy V8s love advance. Running less advance than you can limits horsepower.

"A typical advance curve for an engine built with a mild camshaft and having a compression ratio correctly matched to the cam will look something like this:

14-18 degrees initial advance
18-22 degrees centrifugal
10-12 degrees vacuum advance
Mechanical advance all in by =/< 3000 RPM"

http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/...typical.22_performance_ignition_advance_curve

Mild cam = 14-18 initial BTDC. yes I agree but prefer 14-16

Stock motor no cam = initial 17 BTDC. no I do not agree
 

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If the motor is warm it should be straight up and down. when it is cold it will be completely shut and once started it will open slightly and gradually increase to straight up and down / open.

if it is open ( straight up and down) and it still idles at 1000 rpm it is not your choke causing this. proceed to adjusting your idle screw.

If you have been messing with the idle mixture screws you will have to reset these also but start with the idle speed adjustment. if that has no affect then with engine off turn your Idle mixture screws in all the way until they stop, only stop do not tighten or you will damage the needles. once turned in, turn out 2 1/2 turns, both sides and then return to setting idle speed adjustment with engine running.
 

MadOgre

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No unhooked as in the green wire is not connected to the choke, although it is pretty loose. I can open and shut it by moving it, but it pops back open.


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That is exactly what your looking for. it means your choke is holding in the open / off position.

although THE WIRE SHOULD BE PLUGGED IN TO THE CHOKE
 
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rich weyand

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Mild cam = 14-18 initial BTDC. yes I agree but prefer 14-16

Stock motor no cam = initial 17 BTDC. no I do not agree

It's not a stock motor. The OP noted he is running flat-top pistons, which pushes the CR up toward 9:1.
 

Skweegle89

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That is exactly what your looking for. it means your choke is holding in the open / off position.

although THE WIRE SHOULD BE PLUGGED IN TO THE CHOKE


I just left it unplugged because that's how it was when I got it. I plugged it back in awhile back but nothing changed other than the choke light coming on. I got tired of looking at it so I just unplugged it again. I have done some research on some old posts on here and thought about changing out my oil pressure sensor to see if that fixes it. The fuse for it isn't blown.


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rich weyand

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If the motor is warm it should be straight up and down. when it is cold it will be completely shut and once started it will open slightly and gradually increase to straight up and down / open.

Edelbrock 1406 setup is that choke in fully engaged position with engine off is gap of .100", not completely closed. Other carbs have the full-choke air supply through holes in the choke plate, and full choke position is choke plate completely closed, but the Edelbrock 1406 choke plate is solid, and full-choke air supply is through the .100" gap.
 

Skweegle89

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Mine stays wide open wether it's hot or cold, motor off or running.


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rich weyand

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I just left it unplugged because that's how it was when I got it. I plugged it back in awhile back but nothing changed other than the choke light coming on. I got tired of looking at it so I just unplugged it again. I have done some research on some old posts on here and thought about changing out my oil pressure sensor to see if that fixes it. The fuse for it isn't blown.

No difference between having the choke connected or not connected, and choke light not turning off, definitely sounds like failed OP sensor.
 

Skweegle89

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Ok, I will still a new one in it this weekend and report back.


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Nalanthi

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I appreciate both schools of thought on timing - and I've known guys to go by both. The only other carbed guy in my circle of shadetree mechanics/offroaders is running a '77 F250 that be swapped a 460 with I want to say an Edelbrock 1411. This guy is extremely "by the books" in his approach - every answer to head or block questions I've ever proposed was answered with "well... take it to the machine shop".
In his setup, he goes with an 8 (sometimes 10 depending) degree advance - no testing, no questions asked, and won't go above that.
I sometimes disagree with his approach based on the fact that sometimes running parts to the shop/going by the book is not the most efficient way in the quest to "just get the damn thing running - as stable as you can with what time and resources you have".

The other school of thought which is to set it for as much as it can handle without knocking is the one that I'm leaning towards, and therefore...

New tune:
10 degrees BTDC was set to 17-18 degrees BTDC.
Idle was dropped to 650ish. The engine doesn't sound like it, but the tach wanders around about 50RPMs.
Vacuum went from 15 to 17Hg and holds steady. This kicked me back into the idle circuit, and I was able to tweak the mixture screws with a very noticeable effect when leaned out too much. I fiddled with them until I got my highest steady reading on the vac gauge.
When the vac advance was reconnected post initial timing, i was reading
about 35-36ish Hg on the gauge.
Additionally, I wired the electric choke to the ignition on the fuse box and confirmed 12v w/ the key on.

A test drive confirmed what feels to be a minor power gain - no knocking.
I assume that a vac leak is out of the question at this point.

I'll top her off this weekend and roll her down to work on Monday, then go from there. Hoping this was enough to put her onto the daily driver roster.



I cannot express enough gratitude. As stated prior, sometimes all it takes is a bit of moral support to make 'em work.
 
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MadOgre

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Edelbrock 1406 setup is that choke in fully engaged position with engine off is gap of .100", not completely closed. Other carbs have the full-choke air supply through holes in the choke plate, and full choke position is choke plate completely closed, but the Edelbrock 1406 choke plate is solid, and full-choke air supply is through the .100" gap.

So this is not closed ?
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Sure looks closed compared to this !
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or this
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MadOgre

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Edelbrock 1406 setup is that choke in fully engaged position with engine off is gap of .100", not completely closed. Other carbs have the full-choke air supply through holes in the choke plate, and full choke position is choke plate completely closed, but the Edelbrock 1406 choke plate is solid, and full-choke air supply is through the .100" gap.

Ya im not sure what holes your talking about ?

You must be registered for see images attach
 
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