Orange Peel Trouble

[Russtypickle]

Hi All,

Well, I know what I did wrong, now I have to ask how to fix it (he said sheepishly)..... Anyway, the exterior of the truck took about an extra week of full time effort to get it ready to spray, as such, I really didn't have my head into it so when I sprayed it, I let my tack coat flash before hitting it hard (which I normally do). Anyway, now the question is do I cut the clear now and respray or is it possible to cut pollish this out? I haven't painted the doors or fenders yet but I suspect they will come out good enough to not really require cut polishing but I also understand that I'll likely have to in order to keep things looking similar. Anyway, it's a bunch of work either way, I'll have to mask off any parts that I'm not going to re-spray if I go that route or I'll have to cut polish the entire truck; either way it's all time. I'd almost prefer if I could cut polish the entire truck because it just looks better. For reference, there's one light tack coat and 3 fairly heavy coats as I realized my mistake as soon as I started my second coat, hence the 4th. Throw shame or thoughts, I'm all ears...
I should mention, the top of the second photo shows what it should look like, basically the interior looks like the top edge of the box.

 

[legopnuematic]

If you have enough clear you could probably cut and buff it.

Worst case block the clear down and flow coat it. Maybe wait until you get everything else painted, get it assembled, then do the flow coat. That way any little assembly scratches or what have you get taken care of.

 

[Russtypickle]

I've never done a flow coat before, can you mask off everything but the sides or do you need to do the entire truck? Because the back is wide open, it means masking off the interior carefully so that no overspray gets on the interior finishes. I could skip putting anything back together inside and just finish and install the doors, fender and hood. Would I then assess what needs to be flow coated or do you typically flow coat the entire truck?

 

[fast 99]

Been painting vehicles for a long time what in the world is flow coating? Might be possible before the hardener goes off, afterwards forget it. Agree sounds like there is enough clear to color sand and buff. Otherwise strip and repaint.

Lots of things can cause that from under reducing to wrong spray tip. Painting isn't easy. Yes anyone can apply material. Good results takes a lot of experience to see a problem and know how to correct it.

 

[Russtypickle]

Thanks guys, I hate to disagree but painting a decent finish isn't really all that hard, it just takes thought, I lost mine trying to rush things and not actually thinking about what I was doing, that's a lack of proficiency. The rest of the truck looks great (things I've painted before and after - interior and rad support). I painted a 68 Bronco about 5 years ago and it came out great without cut polishing so I'm not sure what the tolerance is for doing it. I suspect I'll wait for the doors and fenders to see if I'll flow coat the rear fenders or just cut and polish the entire truck. To be honest, neither sound like fun but I can only imagine cut polishing will take a lot longer but possibly end with better results. That was basically the ask, I said as much in the question, I was just looking for what the process was if I were to flow coat vs cut polish (time and effort & other input like how much sanding cutting will allow - if people have had luck cutting this type of orange peal before).

 

[Grit dog]

My first comment is you must be a really good painter if it’s “not all that difficult” to lay down clear that doesn’t need at least some wet sanding.
If you can spray it to look like glass then sanding out the orange peel and re-spraying seems quicker. Save for whatever you have to do to mask it all off again.
But if you have sufficient clear coat build now, I’d just sand cut polish, and be done with it.
But I’m not a good painter so I just accept a lot of sanding and polishing to make it look good.
Another thing, I learned before I knew the terminology what flow coat is, it’s tough on vertical surfaces. Spraying clear over flat sanded cured clear is much easier to get runs and sags than over fresh tacky previous coats. I did it on the bedsides of the blue truck and the clear coat sagged like melting ice cream in spots. So I didn’t escape some serious sanding in the process.

 

[Sad Sack]

Wet sand the color and the spray clear: never clear coat an orange peel color coat if ya want glassy appearance

 

[Russtypickle]

Thanks Grit dog, that is very helpful and exactly what I was looking for. My comment of "not all that difficult" wasn't to offend anyone, I'm not a good painter by any stretch of the imagination but like you I put more labour in and get something I'm happy with and can afford. I sometimes feel like people say things are difficult when in fact they just take time and patients and a good old fashioned college try to get satisfactory results. I in no way meant my previous paint job was like glass, it was closer to slightly worse than factory stuff and great in places and a bit rough in others, but I was happy with it.

Thanks again, I think that's the road I'm goin to try this time around (cut polish the entire truck). It's going to look better in the end.

 

[Russtypickle]

Wet sand the color and the spray clear: never clear coat an orange peel color coat if ya want glassy appearance

Is that for single stage paints? I've got a base clear coat so I was looking to possibly sand down the clear coat and add a couple coats of clear to build it up again.

 

[Grit dog]

Is that for single stage paints? I've got a base clear coat so I was looking to possibly sand down the clear coat and add a couple coats of clear to build it up again.

@Sad Sack was stating what you were already suggesting. Maybe a bit of interpretation difference in the conversation.
Yes you’d also scuff base coat. If you were spraying anything over it after the recoat window.
No different for single stage. Any finish needs to be prepped for adhesion if it has cured significantly.

 

[Russtypickle]

Perfect, thanks again guys!

 

[bucket]

I'd also like to know what a "flow coat" is. Never heard of that before.

So was there an orange peel finish before or after the clear? If the orange peel is all or mostly in the clearcoat, just cut it and buff it. Now, the longer you wait, the harder it will be. However, it will turn out better and hold a good gloss longer, compared to cutting and buffing when the paint is still fresh.

 

[Grit dog]

I'd also like to know what a "flow coat" is. Never heard of that before.

So was there an orange peel finish before or after the clear? If the orange peel is all or mostly in the clearcoat, just cut it and buff it. Now, the longer you wait, the harder it will be. However, it will turn out better and hold a good gloss longer, compared to cutting and buffing when the paint is still fresh.

I think flow coat is relatively new terminology (but I’m ignorant to a lot of autobody stuff, not in the business).
Agreed on the wait times.
However when you paint as bad as me. Knocking down the orange peel when it’s softer saves a bit of time.
Ideally knock it down a day or 2 after spraying (as soon as it doesn’t ball up or gum up the paper). Let it cure a while, then finish wet sanding and cut n polish.
Again that’s my little workaround to save a little effort as a bad painter (or bad setup). Seems I newer have the time or need to paint until the weather turns to **** then heat and/or ventilation is a problem for anything larger than single parts or panels.

 

[Camar068]

My first comment is you must be a really good painter if it’s “not all that difficult” to lay down clear that doesn’t need at least some wet sanding.
If you can spray it to look like glass then sanding out the orange peel and re-spraying seems quicker. Save for whatever you have to do to mask it all off again.
But if you have sufficient clear coat build now, I’d just sand cut polish, and be done with it.
But I’m not a good painter so I just accept a lot of sanding and polishing to make it look good.
Another thing, I learned before I knew the terminology what flow coat is, it’s tough on vertical surfaces. Spraying clear over flat sanded cured clear is much easier to get runs and sags than over fresh tacky previous coats. I did it on the bedsides of the blue truck and the clear coat sagged like melting ice cream in spots. So I didn’t escape some serious sanding in the process.

Nothing meant, but my dad has been painting since the early '80's when I was 10'ish. Anyway, I asked him about orange peel. He rattled off a bunch of science/experience. Can I remember it no.

Did I ever see a paint job by him that had orange peel.....no. Guessing he looked at it as ....spend the time to learn and not waste time later? Again guessing.

Helped with his paint jobs from 81-97. We never did anything unless there was a stray bug/run.

 

[Trucksareforwork]

I’m a really inexperienced painter (only a couple of vehicles) but spend a lot of time contemplating… so I’ll just chip this in: the most counterintuitive aspect of spraying is that having the gun too far from the surface creates more orange peel than having it too close.

Trying too hard not to hammer on too much paint by holding the gun away leads to an orange peel surface, at least in my shop. I manage amount of application by pace of gun movement and quality of application by gun setting and distance from the piece.

I don’t know what the experts would say.

That said: if your orange peel is in the clear, I personally would make sure I had enough clear on there and just manage with cut and buff.