Different tires or LSD in front or back?

[AuroraGirl]

So I'm gonna pose the question as one of the other. Would I, snow plowing being the biggest need application, benefit from some new tires on a single axle(rear I'm guessing??) Or from putting LSD of a locker setup in the front or rear. I say that because it can be had for about the same price.

I don't wanna do both. I'm not gonna lie, plowing wasn't too bad after having working 4wd and tires that weren't 30 years old and stiff and bald. But I felt if I just had a little bit more the few times I got stuck from traction rather than learning curve adjustments would be avoided or easily recovered. I don't plan on plowing more than what I have already but I know it would make more sense to do posi than, say, put new tires of the same kind. Bfg ko2. But I want to put skinny snow tires on a single axle because I have 2 extra rims that aren't split rims and I could put these back on for summer float so I don't sink every where wet. But the tires are 1/3 tread at worst with 0/3 meaning time to replace because it's about to be wear bar or time or legal, not bald. So I have meat left to them. And they aren't terribly old. And since I don't drive the road, I don't think putting new tires on the same size is gonna change my experience too much. But snow tires are Marvel's, and skinny ones would be better.

If tires, which axle? What sizes in radials work well with squares?

If locker, which kind of setup? LSD?
Which axle? I almost never use 2wd at the moment, and I mostlg get stuck in nose down scenarios. But that's a lot of factory's there

I do try to avoid sharp 4wd turns and disengage if I got flat ground or good bite to make it in 2wd. Definitely doesn't slip much with current tires if I don't gun it, that's where I mostly lost traction. But my drivetrain had bad mounts and torque application we found, so I will fix that.

4lo was almost never necessary, and I once used granny gear with 4lo and pushed a pile of decent size with no throttle and it lost traction a bit but found dirt to recatch, if any of you plow and can picture my scenario.

Np208, 350, is gonna run better and have more applied torque this year vs losses

14 rear, full float. 4.10 gears
D44 4.10 front. Will have new u joints on worn components.

Advice welcome! It's a matter of what I could accomplish for similar money, what would make sense for given applications. Don't consider summer use for recommending, because it's all down the road anyway

 

[Grit dog]

If you get a lsd that doesn't require replacing the carrier and re-setting the gears, it's probably half the cost or less as one that does.
But why? There are sooo many more options that cost the same or less and require no mechanical work to get more traction. Besides, your rookie plow year was during a record snow year and you're still here to talk about it. You'd be pissing money away to LSD a truck that isn't worth more than the LSD going into it.

First define stuck. Spinning out on ice or digging into snow and spinning?
Second, how can you plow better to not get stuck? Presume mostly gravel, not paved? If you plow before the snow gets runover by vehicles, you can basically plow it bare every single time, all winter.
Third, what to do for more traction? What tire pressures were you running and how much weight in the back of the truck? Just yard plowin, I'd be at maybe 35psi front with a 8' steel blade and like 20psi in back with no weight. Want traction? Put 1500lbs in the truck bed, further back the better (raise pressure accordingly).
Of course these things require a truck that actually has rear springs in one piece and a transfer cast that isn't slapping the floor pan everytime you touch the throttle, so fix that first.

Tires, any tire near 50% tread or less will basically suck compared to a new tire. Fact. Idk what your current tires look like other than rambling about not bald and something about 0/3 and 1/3 tread and summer and and and...

What to use for tires? I've run a new set of AT tires that would do most anything you throw at it for snowplowing. 33s on a 1 wheeler peeler blazer at that.
That was probably the best setup I ever most of the work trucks had whatever tires were on them year round. Sometimes lucky and had good tread, sometimes not so much.

Better than that? If ice is the issue, sipe the tires, or stud the tires, or both. IMO, the ideal best tire for anything snow is a solid block mudder with siped the interior tread rows and halfway out into the outside rows (unless studding too, then just interior rows). Stud the tires, run min air pressure you can get away with for the application.
And why the heck would you swap summer and winter tires for a vehicle that only gets driven around in circles in the pasture?

Collect your thoughts, you're all over the place here. If you want good traction, get good tires, leave the junk in the junk piles (preferably where you won't hit it with the snowplow) and move on.
If it's really bad outside, pick up a set of chains. Again cheap, easy and at least have residual value.
There are probably 20 things to do to that truck to better prepare it for plowing than making yet another project out of part of it that works good already.

 

[bucket]

I agree, simply invest in a good set of tires that will help get the job done.

Of course, that opens up a whole other can of worms. What's the best tire for heavy snow? Opinions will vary widely and opinions may be strong too.

 

[Grit dog]

Of course, that opens up a whole other can of worms. What's the best tire for heavy snow? Opinions will vary widely and opinions may be strong too.

That's like an oil thread, except I could give 2 chits about oil, but have spent my life in the upper midwest, the Rockies from Wyoming to NM, the White mtns of AZ, the Cascades, wet and dry sides and AK from SE AK to the N Slope. Typically picking the worst weather to hook a 30' trailer and head up the mountain, for fun.
Tire brand doesn't mean squat, within reason, but tire tread type, compound, how you prep them for low traction (snow and Ice), air pressure and the type of snow make all the difference.

 

[Grit dog]

Edit: double post

 

[Turbo4whl]

You want to go in the snow? Old tires, open axles, spend the money on these: (just my 2 cents)

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You must be registered for see images attach

 

[shiftpro]

Something on lockers... FRONT lockers..

I have over decades collected a decent amount of experience with these.
If it's a clutched limited slip type, they just slip when you need them.
Lockers, well they break front axle U joints, and often takes out the knuckle. Especially with larger high grip tires. Usually when backing out of a hole.
The slightest turn of the wheel and the front joints open up drastically reducing their strength. You hear this SNAP and instantly go into denial... "oh
must have been a rock tossed up"... "spring was binding"... then you have to face the music.

Once you break a few front axles you get the hang of the front locker and life is much better!
The other thing is, the truck will not self-center and you have to return the steering wheel to straight. Again, one will get used to this but the forst couple times out can be a handful.

And my last testament... I would never put a front locker in anything LESS than and D60 WITH D70 front stub shafts, but that's just me.

Rear locker... Yes 100%.

Chains... absolutely!

You want the chains like the back and white pic Turbo posted, with the little diggers on them. Well worth the extra $$..
And you can customize chains by adding more cross runs... so there is a chain every 4" instead of 8". Your chain set will weigh more but in the snow and ice... ALL GOOD!

 

[Grit dog]

Or, she’s plowing her driveway in Wisconsin, not pulling the weight of a 20 mile team up the side of a mountain through 5’ of snow.
Chains would be a good economical alternative to New tires if just getting 1 pair.
But then again, the normal solution to poor traction with bad tires is to simply get new tires.

 

[AuroraGirl]

If you get a lsd that doesn't require replacing the carrier and re-setting the gears, it's probably half the cost or less as one that does.
But why? There are sooo many more options that cost the same or less and require no mechanical work to get more traction. Besides, your rookie plow year was during a record snow year and you're still here to talk about it. You'd be pissing money away to LSD a truck that isn't worth more than the LSD going into it.

First define stuck. Spinning out on ice or digging into snow and spinning?
Second, how can you plow better to not get stuck? Presume mostly gravel, not paved? If you plow before the snow gets runover by vehicles, you can basically plow it bare every single time, all winter.
Third, what to do for more traction? What tire pressures were you running and how much weight in the back of the truck? Just yard plowin, I'd be at maybe 35psi front with a 8' steel blade and like 20psi in back with no weight. Want traction? Put 1500lbs in the truck bed, further back the better (raise pressure accordingly).
Of course these things require a truck that actually has rear springs in one piece and a transfer cast that isn't slapping the floor pan everytime you touch the throttle, so fix that first.

Tires, any tire near 50% tread or less will basically suck compared to a new tire. Fact. Idk what your current tires look like other than rambling about not bald and something about 0/3 and 1/3 tread and summer and and and...

What to use for tires? I've run a new set of AT tires that would do most anything you throw at it for snowplowing. 33s on a 1 wheeler peeler blazer at that.
That was probably the best setup I ever most of the work trucks had whatever tires were on them year round. Sometimes lucky and had good tread, sometimes not so much.

Better than that? If ice is the issue, sipe the tires, or stud the tires, or both. IMO, the ideal best tire for anything snow is a solid block mudder with siped the interior tread rows and halfway out into the outside rows (unless studding too, then just interior rows). Stud the tires, run min air pressure you can get away with for the application.
And why the heck would you swap summer and winter tires for a vehicle that only gets driven around in circles in the pasture?

Collect your thoughts, you're all over the place here. If you want good traction, get good tires, leave the junk in the junk piles (preferably where you won't hit it with the snowplow) and move on.
If it's really bad outside, pick up a set of chains. Again cheap, easy and at least have residual value.
There are probably 20 things to do to that truck to better prepare it for plowing than making yet another project out of part of it that works good already.

i do appreciate your input.

I do think it could go for a lighter salt content.

but it is appreciated.

I do not plow much gravel, mostly dirt/grass and very very short amount of pavement and a bit of gravel on the incline of the driveway. I dont want to tear up earth with chains, but i will be investing in a set for just in case scenarios. never hurts to havr them.

Stuck: snow up to running boards, which are also coming off for two reasons. 1), not structurally supporting of the weight of a small squrriel 2) one more thing to provide friction against when stuck as i was that holds truck above the ground. Wheels were spinning because front end was not touching the ground and of course the rear cant pull it uphill in reverse with the front in snow. this was due to angling of property on this spot where it has quite the drop off that once the nose of my truck is level after going over the hill, the truck is alrady 7 feet inward where the plow couldnt clear the ground because it wasnt set to be able to drop more than slightly less than level, rather than a 20 deg angle or so. bad timing and choice on my mark, but hadnt encountered or remembered the contour. i dug it out with a shovel and sweat/blood. i used wood stakes that i pound under the tires to give the truck something to spin on that was at its height, i sanded behind the tires, and i raised plow super high to raise it OFF the snow, so it wasnt resisting movement.a couople clutch dumping rocks and i was out. long ass 3 hours or so.
if i had a working tractor that would have done some work, i have chains for that lol. big old gear reduction and large tractor at that. This pic was taken after it was really stuck, like, days later. similar spot but more angled toward me in this photo, and into snow without actually having pushed any. this photo i was stuck because The plow actually glided up the pile until it got stuck and it was holding my front end hostage., i just lifted the plow further and put wood under tires and did sand. was overkill, would have done just sand and lift plow on a redo of life.

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I can plow with better technique, angling, fix my plow pin sheet so i can pin it and it not have so much side to side play rather than now its pretty bad, undersized pins were used for years so it wore the holes larger. And some dont do the job anymore, they are broken.

You must be registered for see images attach

I was thinking about making the metal sheet thicker and using an appropiate pin shape,(maybe more than one pin if possible) and the little guide guys on the left taller, maybe.

My tires are just under 50%, from their new 13/16th IIRC(I looked this up a long time ago) I was sitting at 7/32 when i checked them. minus one front one having bald center, previous owner(step dad) had overinflation in one tire.If i found an equal shape used on on fb i would pay 25 bucks for one lol just to have meat on that one tire. i put it on driver front.

Weight: 1270 or so pounds in sand, used one tube at one point for getting unstuck. added 4 more for the last few weeks of plowing. could handle more. also had an OEM 1980 hood in the bed. and a rack of steel pipe is visible, and its got a custom hitch and bumper that are pretty heavy. the hitch for hay wagons is gotta be 200+ pounds in just thick steel. most weight over rear axle specifically . also some snow.

tires: whatever door jamb said at max psi for my truck and if it didnt exceed the tire max pressure i added 5psi. one tire lost air in any considerable amount, like 5 psi most. like i said, about half tread. I know its not new, but it was free tires vs my old bias ply tires that were bald. 10 ply. Radial.
i currently have a bias ply from this batch mounted as my bed spair. quite grizzly.

What I decide to spend time and money on frankly isnt your concern in the way that you feel the need to preach about it. Im fully aware that my truck isnt perfect and its a lot of money to drop on a machine that moves snow.
But I also have inherited a machine with a lot of family value and historical value, and it was built into a snow plow by mostly fabricated stuff. For my grandma, that means a lot, for me it does, and its a learning experience for me.

I know tires. I know how to mount one(i pay for this, too much headache past lawn mower without a machine), balancing, and what the science of tires are and what works in what.
I know a tall, skinny tire that has good tread pattern and is a winter tire is going to very well outperform AT. AT tires, which are mostly found in wider footprints, are floatational. great in summer for the grass and lawn and mud. @Vbb199 always thinking about u bb
but floatation is not what you want in snow, you want to cut through it and you want to make contact with a surface. thats usually dirt/grass or even ice. ice with sand embeded in it isnt slippery, and will naturally keep from being slick with even some melting.

But I know the fact its a snow tire changes a LOT of a tires properties, and even the best snowtire has physical limits atm. Silica in the tires usually means softer at lower temps, which means they retain their STICKY grip and dont become rigid. and it also means too soft in summer, which i know they would be in the shed in summer.

BUT, I have NOT had experience with LSD(limited slip differential) nor can i compare it to tires. I do have experience going from "good" all season tires to basic snow tires. night and day, btu this was a fwd car, not a 4x4 plow truck.
In fixing things, like I SAID i was going to be doing, I plan on new springs i think ive come to that conclusion. decent sets arent bad.
but i would definitely go 4 spring front, my plow puts a weight bias toward the FRONT hence my asking where should i put said changes if i were to make them.

So, im looking for the thoughts of you guys, who i respect and know know their ****, because iif you can honest to go say that new tires outperformed LSD/lockers, I would believe you because ive seen how well and mch a change they had on a car, but couldnt speak to a truck sicne i dont know. But I also know one wheel peel is called it for a reason. 1 wheel on front and back spinning is not 4x4, lockers would be 4wd and that would double traction surface area, which im not dense and know that if you were peeling out everytime you use it, ofc you will get stuck again.

Also, you do not know what I use my truck for in the summer because i have not shared that as much as snow, which is the primary purpose, and frankly it doesnt matter. I drive it around the yard to smile and to get it used periodically, not to dazzle. And ive learned a lot just taking it for a spin and observing its behavior. Reactions. I have most recently used it to provide headlight lighting while working on trailer, ive used it to move stuff on property esp up the hill in the rear, becaue its steep and f150 cant handle that well on a running start if there is any moisture in that grass. steep.i also used it to clean up some yard brush as a good truck to take to the back and dump yard waste in woods. It aint much, but its something. That plan will include once more when load regal and more where i want it, which includes trailers and handling bigger loads for activies or moving things where having the anchor be obscenely heavy. ITs kinda nice,so either as the thing that is the pivot point be large and supportive or the thing is doing the pulling be heavy and grip with its tires be able to just tug and object out of where it has sat.

But even assuming i didnt do that, I asked specifcially to name me what you think works better for snow plow, but what would ultimately offer the most round and worth it option. money is not an object here. i got a bonus and i kinda looked at kwik pricing, and i got 400 that i could put to 3 good or 2 good tires, or i could get a unit, because even if over price i can justify the cost of the benefits are great.



And dont need to show concerns for my projects. I have little time sadly to do things i want, but i do make my way to things whn i can, but i need to know what tolook for and that could be a while researching the day i decide its gonna get done.
if i choose to waste time thats my issue, or misfortune.

but yes, ultimately i know the value of a good tire. i just dont have the experience to compare or know what would assist me more for the similar amount of money in more than one way

 

[Vbb199]

i do appreciate your input.

I do think it could go for a lighter salt content.

but it is appreciated.

I do not plow much gravel, mostly dirt/grass and very very short amount of pavement and a bit of gravel on the incline of the driveway. I dont want to tear up earth with chains, but i will be investing in a set for just in case scenarios. never hurts to havr them.

Stuck: snow up to running boards, which are also coming off for two reasons. 1), not structurally supporting of the weight of a small squrriel 2) one more thing to provide friction against when stuck as i was that holds truck above the ground. Wheels were spinning because front end was not touching the ground and of course the rear cant pull it uphill in reverse with the front in snow. this was due to angling of property on this spot where it has quite the drop off that once the nose of my truck is level after going over the hill, the truck is alrady 7 feet inward where the plow couldnt clear the ground because it wasnt set to be able to drop more than slightly less than level, rather than a 20 deg angle or so. bad timing and choice on my mark, but hadnt encountered or remembered the contour. i dug it out with a shovel and sweat/blood. i used wood stakes that i pound under the tires to give the truck something to spin on that was at its height, i sanded behind the tires, and i raised plow super high to raise it OFF the snow, so it wasnt resisting movement.a couople clutch dumping rocks and i was out. long ass 3 hours or so.
if i had a working tractor that would have done some work, i have chains for that lol. big old gear reduction and large tractor at that. This pic was taken after it was really stuck, like, days later. similar spot but more angled toward me in this photo, and into snow without actually having pushed any. this photo i was stuck because The plow actually glided up the pile until it got stuck and it was holding my front end hostage., i just lifted the plow further and put wood under tires and did sand. was overkill, would have done just sand and lift plow on a redo of life.

You must be registered for see images attach

I can plow with better technique, angling, fix my plow pin sheet so i can pin it and it not have so much side to side play rather than now its pretty bad, undersized pins were used for years so it wore the holes larger. And some dont do the job anymore, they are broken.

You must be registered for see images attach

I was thinking about making the metal sheet thicker and using an appropiate pin shape,(maybe more than one pin if possible) and the little guide guys on the left taller, maybe.

My tires are just under 50%, from their new 13/16th IIRC(I looked this up a long time ago) I was sitting at 7/32 when i checked them. minus one front one having bald center, previous owner(step dad) had overinflation in one tire.If i found an equal shape used on on fb i would pay 25 bucks for one lol just to have meat on that one tire. i put it on driver front.

Weight: 1270 or so pounds in sand, used one tube at one point for getting unstuck. added 4 more for the last few weeks of plowing. could handle more. also had an OEM 1980 hood in the bed. and a rack of steel pipe is visible, and its got a custom hitch and bumper that are pretty heavy. the hitch for hay wagons is gotta be 200+ pounds in just thick steel. most weight over rear axle specifically . also some snow.

tires: whatever door jamb said at max psi for my truck and if it didnt exceed the tire max pressure i added 5psi. one tire lost air in any considerable amount, like 5 psi most. like i said, about half tread. I know its not new, but it was free tires vs my old bias ply tires that were bald. 10 ply. Radial.
i currently have a bias ply from this batch mounted as my bed spair. quite grizzly.

What I decide to spend time and money on frankly isnt your concern in the way that you feel the need to preach about it. Im fully aware that my truck isnt perfect and its a lot of money to drop on a machine that moves snow.
But I also have inherited a machine with a lot of family value and historical value, and it was built into a snow plow by mostly fabricated stuff. For my grandma, that means a lot, for me it does, and its a learning experience for me.

I know tires. I know how to mount one(i pay for this, too much headache past lawn mower without a machine), balancing, and what the science of tires are and what works in what.
I know a tall, skinny tire that has good tread pattern and is a winter tire is going to very well outperform AT. AT tires, which are mostly found in wider footprints, are floatational. great in summer for the grass and lawn and mud. @Vbb199 always thinking about u bb
but floatation is not what you want in snow, you want to cut through it and you want to make contact with a surface. thats usually dirt/grass or even ice. ice with sand embeded in it isnt slippery, and will naturally keep from being slick with even some melting.

But I know the fact its a snow tire changes a LOT of a tires properties, and even the best snowtire has physical limits atm. Silica in the tires usually means softer at lower temps, which means they retain their STICKY grip and dont become rigid. and it also means too soft in summer, which i know they would be in the shed in summer.

BUT, I have NOT had experience with LSD(limited slip differential) nor can i compare it to tires. I do have experience going from "good" all season tires to basic snow tires. night and day, btu this was a fwd car, not a 4x4 plow truck.
In fixing things, like I SAID i was going to be doing, I plan on new springs i think ive come to that conclusion. decent sets arent bad.
but i would definitely go 4 spring front, my plow puts a weight bias toward the FRONT hence my asking where should i put said changes if i were to make them.

So, im looking for the thoughts of you guys, who i respect and know know their ****, because iif you can honest to go say that new tires outperformed LSD/lockers, I would believe you because ive seen how well and mch a change they had on a car, but couldnt speak to a truck sicne i dont know. But I also know one wheel peel is called it for a reason. 1 wheel on front and back spinning is not 4x4, lockers would be 4wd and that would double traction surface area, which im not dense and know that if you were peeling out everytime you use it, ofc you will get stuck again.

Also, you do not know what I use my truck for in the summer because i have not shared that as much as snow, which is the primary purpose, and frankly it doesnt matter. I drive it around the yard to smile and to get it used periodically, not to dazzle. And ive learned a lot just taking it for a spin and observing its behavior. Reactions. I have most recently used it to provide headlight lighting while working on trailer, ive used it to move stuff on property esp up the hill in the rear, becaue its steep and f150 cant handle that well on a running start if there is any moisture in that grass. steep.i also used it to clean up some yard brush as a good truck to take to the back and dump yard waste in woods. It aint much, but its something. That plan will include once more when load regal and more where i want it, which includes trailers and handling bigger loads for activies or moving things where having the anchor be obscenely heavy. ITs kinda nice,so either as the thing that is the pivot point be large and supportive or the thing is doing the pulling be heavy and grip with its tires be able to just tug and object out of where it has sat.

But even assuming i didnt do that, I asked specifcially to name me what you think works better for snow plow, but what would ultimately offer the most round and worth it option. money is not an object here. i got a bonus and i kinda looked at kwik pricing, and i got 400 that i could put to 3 good or 2 good tires, or i could get a unit, because even if over price i can justify the cost of the benefits are great.



And dont need to show concerns for my projects. I have little time sadly to do things i want, but i do make my way to things whn i can, but i need to know what tolook for and that could be a while researching the day i decide its gonna get done.
if i choose to waste time thats my issue, or misfortune.

but yes, ultimately i know the value of a good tire. i just dont have the experience to compare or know what would assist me more for the similar amount of money in more than one way

I was tagged.
New fone, who dis?

You need R1 tractor tires or cut and scooped out boggers!

If you're tryna just plow, and only Gonna ride on the road once in a while, just Lincoln locker that mf.

BUT you'll need a open diff to do Lincoln locker on a 14b ff.

 

[Vbb199]

Which reminds me.
I need to get my **** together with my grenaded trans in the s10, I wanna take my s10 playing in the snow during the winter.

 

[Vbb199]

Hay...

You must be registered for see images attach

I SAW LSD!

LETS TALK ABOUT LSD!

 

[AuroraGirl]

I was tagged.
New fone, who dis?

You need R1 tractor tires or cut and scooped out boggers!

If you're tryna just plow, and only Gonna ride on the road once in a while, just Lincoln locker that mf.

BUT you'll need a open diff to do Lincoln locker on a 14b ff.

Okay thats a good advice from a mud fish. So a good example of this is while a lincoln locker may mean opening a diff, it means me learning about diffs or what to do inside. i have a diff that is off the truck i could either do the work on and put on or i could use it for a model that is easily viewed.
good stuff.

Is it activated by something?

 

[AuroraGirl]

Something on lockers... FRONT lockers..

I have over decades collected a decent amount of experience with these.
If it's a clutched limited slip type, they just slip when you need them.
Lockers, well they break front axle U joints, and often takes out the knuckle. Especially with larger high grip tires. Usually when backing out of a hole.
The slightest turn of the wheel and the front joints open up drastically reducing their strength. You hear this SNAP and instantly go into denial... "oh
must have been a rock tossed up"... "spring was binding"... then you have to face the music.

Once you break a few front axles you get the hang of the front locker and life is much better!
The other thing is, the truck will not self-center and you have to return the steering wheel to straight. Again, one will get used to this but the forst couple times out can be a handful.

And my last testament... I would never put a front locker in anything LESS than and D60 WITH D70 front stub shafts, but that's just me.

Rear locker... Yes 100%.

Chains... absolutely!

You want the chains like the back and white pic Turbo posted, with the little diggers on them. Well worth the extra $$..
And you can customize chains by adding more cross runs... so there is a chain every 4" instead of 8". Your chain set will weigh more but in the snow and ice... ALL GOOD!

okay that is good to know. so since im not gonna be using this often, or in such severe conditions, a front locker might not be something that fits me, esp if it bindsn easy and snap. but perhaps LSD even if it slips too much would still provide something? Or falls flat?

 

[Vbb199]

Okay thats a good advice from a mud fish. So a good example of this is while a lincoln locker may mean opening a diff, it means me learning about diffs or what to do inside. i have a diff that is off the truck i could either do the work on and put on or i could use it for a model that is easily viewed.
good stuff.

Is it activated by something?

Oh geez......
Mud fish. LMFAO.
Lincoln locker is low budget terminology for welding the spider gears in the axle solid.

It is a permanently locked differential.

But it seems like you're not a fan of anything permanent.