What to do...

80BrownK10 · Dec 24, 2019

thecantaloupeman said:
I did in fact replace the fuel filter a couple months ago. That should definitely be okay. The fuel pump was recently replaced as well before I got the truck. The shop tested the fuel pump and said it was working perfectly fine.

Their guess was the module, and they have been trying to get it to fail again but haven’t been able to. We’ll see what they say on the phone tomorrow.

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Get your truck from them. Just say you will run it till it fails again. You can't drive it while they have it. Park it at the house. Use the money you would pay them to fix it to fix all the stuff we have mentioned. Like I said start all new with the ignition wear parts. This stuff won't take long. We say that because most of us have done it before. I know new repairs can be intimidating, but these really are not hard. Seriously watch YouTube. And even though it will take you longer I'm confident at most it will take you a few evenings after work to get it done. Your truck is sitting at the shop now so what's having it down a few evenings going to matter.

If they say fuel pump is good I would out money on it is. They usually show weak on stuff when really needing fuel not trying to idle and start when they start to go bad...then they just fail and don't work or they fill your crankcase with fuel and you end up smoking cause your oil is overfilled from dilution from gas.

I am willing to bet this is an ignition components that's old. As it heats up...and maybe not even every time some connection is broken as it expands as it gets hot. Things expand when hot. Go on Rock Auto, look up the parts we mentioned. Get a cap, rotor, module, coul,and plugs and wires. Make sure you try and get things from as few warehouses as possible to reduce shipping cost. I would be surprised if all this costs $150. All of these parts are wear parts. There not intended to last a lifetime, they wear out.

thecantaloupeman · Dec 26, 2019

80BrownK10 said:
Get your truck from them. Just say you will run it till it fails again. You can't drive it while they have it. Park it at the house. Use the money you would pay them to fix it to fix all the stuff we have mentioned. Like I said start all new with the ignition wear parts. This stuff won't take long. We say that because most of us have done it before. I know new repairs can be intimidating, but these really are not hard. Seriously watch YouTube. And even though it will take you longer I'm confident at most it will take you a few evenings after work to get it done. Your truck is sitting at the shop now so what's having it down a few evenings going to matter.

If they say fuel pump is good I would out money on it is. They usually show weak on stuff when really needing fuel not trying to idle and start when they start to go bad...then they just fail and don't work or they fill your crankcase with fuel and you end up smoking cause your oil is overfilled from dilution from gas.

I am willing to bet this is an ignition components that's old. As it heats up...and maybe not even every time some connection is broken as it expands as it gets hot. Things expand when hot. Go on Rock Auto, look up the parts we mentioned. Get a cap, rotor, module, coul,and plugs and wires. Make sure you try and get things from as few warehouses as possible to reduce shipping cost. I would be surprised if all this costs $150. All of these parts are wear parts. There not intended to last a lifetime, they wear out.

Just an update. I picked it up and to my surprise they cut my cost in half because they didn’t find the problem. I also cleared up that the module in fact was 58$ for parts and 132$ for labor. They must have told me the combined cost if they charged me 120$ for the inspection and 194$ for the module. Still a bit steep but definitely reasonable.

They certainly seem to be trustworthy and know what they are doing. They did spark testing, ran a gas analyzer, fixed my carb adjustment that was apparently way off, tested the fuel pump vacuum.

They even discovered my negative cable was loose and caused it to not crank for them once. They fixed that, and now I know why it didn’t crank that one time at the airport.

I am gonna keep driving it and see what happens. If it does it again, I’m gonna test the spark and try to rule that out. At least now I think I have it narrowed down to either fuel pump or some sort of spark issue.

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80BrownK10 · Dec 26, 2019

thecantaloupeman said:
Just an update. I picked it up and to my surprise they cut my cost in half because they didn’t find the problem. I also cleared up that the module in fact was 58$ for parts and 132$ for labor. They must have told me the combined cost if they charged me 120$ for the inspection and 194$ for the module. Still a bit steep but definitely reasonable.

They certainly seem to be trustworthy and know what they are doing. They did spark testing, ran a gas analyzer, fixed my carb adjustment that was apparently way off, tested the fuel pump vacuum.

They even discovered my negative cable was loose and caused it to not crank for them once. They fixed that, and now I know why it didn’t crank that one time at the airport.

I am gonna keep driving it and see what happens. If it does it again, I’m gonna test the spark and try to rule that out. At least now I think I have it narrowed down to either fuel pump or some sort of spark issue.

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I don't think it's the fuel pump. There mechanical. They either work or they don't, they work and leak or their weak. They won't work one day then not the next. Or it's not like an electric one that may get weak when it's hot. So it can't work up to a light...then totally fail, then start up 6 hours later in a shop due to a fuel pump. If I were a betting person I would out money on a coil or ignition module. Knowing the one I. There was 40 years old it's very suspect.

talltidefan · Dec 26, 2019

I had a similar problem, and my voltage gauge was way off. New alternator solved my problem. .02$

Talltidefan

thecantaloupeman · Jan 3, 2020

80BrownK10 said:
I don't think it's the fuel pump. There mechanical. They either work or they don't, they work and leak or their weak. They won't work one day then not the next. Or it's not like an electric one that may get weak when it's hot. So it can't work up to a light...then totally fail, then start up 6 hours later in a shop due to a fuel pump. If I were a betting person I would out money on a coil or ignition module. Knowing the one I. There was 40 years old it's very suspect.

Just an update. I was driving to work the other day and it seems to be sputtering and losing power again. Mostly when accelerating from a stop and usually it’s when I accelerate slowly. I don’t know how else to describe it but I hear the rpms drop considerably and I hear the exhaust sputter, and it almost feels like I took my foot off the pedal when in fact it is not. It didn’t stall on the way there or the way back but I definitely got scared a few times.

It’s strange to me that before it completely stalled at a light after doing the sputtering and cruising slowly for a bit, but this time it did the sputtering and didn’t die (thank the lord).

I am planning on at least changing my battery cables, spark plug wires and ignition module and seeing what happens. I’m also starting to wonder though if this is a carb problem. Even though it was just rebuilt and I put a quality new accelerator pump in. For some reason right after I got it back from the shop I drove it and it was okay, but now it got a lot colder and it does the same thing. I’m thinking it’s related to the cold somehow.

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Snoots · Jan 3, 2020

Fuel filter?

Check all of your vacuum hoses too.

80BrownK10 · Jan 3, 2020

Now that could be a fuel pump "dies mostly when I try to accelerate" there like $30 and not a difficult repair.

But like said make sure filters are clean the carb one and any inlines that may be there and make sure it's not sucking air.

If it were me I might be tempted to throw a fuel pump in it just to see.

chengny · Jan 4, 2020

I am planning on at least changing my battery cables

Look closely at the entire run of the positive cable. A short to ground in that circuit will knock you right down and then frequently "fix" itself - for a while anyway.

I should also mention I had an issue a while back where I got stuck at the airport and my car wouldn’t even crank. It took about an hour sitting before it started again. I thought maybe it was the solenoid going bad, but it never happened again and now I’m actually wondering if it’s a related issue. Maybe that gives us more clues.

Not saying this is your problem, but this same thing happened to me a few years ago.

I had the same symptoms; complete loss of power in the entire system for no apparent reason - which would then resolve itself without any action on my part. No obvious problems like; shaky fusible links, broken/loose cables, etc. Battery would always check as good. Started off as just an occasional nuisance, then it became so frequent it was annoying. Finally, one night it happened at a busy intersection. The cops came. They told me if I didn't move it they would have it towed. I wasn't about to pay $150 for a tow to a city lot. There was a gas station right across the intersection and I asked the cop if he would help me push it over. "No can do". Somehow, I pushed/steered that 3/4 ton truck through the intersection and into the parking lot by myself. But that was it, I had to figure out what was going on.

Carefully trace/inspect the battery positive cable from the battery to the starter. Look for any possible points where it could be grounding to the engine or frame. If you do find a ground fault, it won't be a big one (if it was, your cable would melt) and it most likely will not be in constant contact. A worn out area in the insulation - that allows a short to ground - doesn't just appear one day as a big hole. If a cable is in contact with - but not held tightly against - a metal surface, vibration will eventually cause the insulation to wear. But the area of copper conductor that is exposed starts off as a tiny contact point.

And, because of vibration and looseness of the cable, it might not even always be in contact with the chafing point. So at first, the cable itself appears okay. But when that exposed area of conductor does short to ground, it shunts the power straight back to the battery negative and away from the rest of the system.

A short to ground in the primary power cable will most times cause you to lose the plant. Everything will go dead. But, quite often, you will still be able to read voltage at the firewall JB, fuse block, etc. Then awhile later, after the engine has cooled, the cable shifts and the ground contact is lost. Or maybe you make the cable move when you open/close the hood to investigate - or even slam your door shut in disgust.

thecantaloupeman · Jan 7, 2020

chengny said:
I am planning on at least changing my battery cables

Look closely at the entire run of the positive cable. A short to ground in that circuit will knock you right down and then frequently "fix" itself - for a while anyway.

I should also mention I had an issue a while back where I got stuck at the airport and my car wouldn’t even crank. It took about an hour sitting before it started again. I thought maybe it was the solenoid going bad, but it never happened again and now I’m actually wondering if it’s a related issue. Maybe that gives us more clues.

Not saying this is your problem, but this same thing happened to me a few years ago.

I had the same symptoms; complete loss of power in the entire system for no apparent reason - which would then resolve itself without any action on my part. No obvious problems like; shaky fusible links, broken/loose cables, etc. Battery would always check as good. Started off as just an occasional nuisance, then it became so frequent it was annoying. Finally, one night it happened at a busy intersection. The cops came. They told me if I didn't move it they would have it towed. I wasn't about to pay $150 for a tow to a city lot. There was a gas station right across the intersection and I asked the cop if he would help me push it over. "No can do". Somehow, I pushed/steered that 3/4 ton truck through the intersection and into the parking lot by myself. But that was it, I had to figure out what was going on.

Carefully trace/inspect the battery positive cable from the battery to the starter. Look for any possible points where it could be grounding to the engine or frame. If you do find a ground fault, it won't be a big one (if it was, your cable would melt) and it most likely will not be in constant contact. A worn out area in the insulation - that allows a short to ground - doesn't just appear one day as a big hole. If a cable is in contact with - but not held tightly against - a metal surface, vibration will eventually cause the insulation to wear. But the area of copper conductor that is exposed starts off as a tiny contact point.

And, because of vibration and looseness of the cable, it might not even always be in contact with the chafing point. So at first, the cable itself appears okay. But when that exposed area of conductor does short to ground, it shunts the power straight back to the battery negative and away from the rest of the system.

A short to ground in the primary power cable will most times cause you to lose the plant. Everything will go dead. But, quite often, you will still be able to read voltage at the firewall JB, fuse block, etc. Then awhile later, after the engine has cooled, the cable shifts and the ground contact is lost. Or maybe you make the cable move when you open/close the hood to investigate - or even slam your door shut in disgust.

Thanks! I'm definitely going to give this a look. I plan on replacing those battery cables. My negative cable is missing some insulation near the ground and has electrical tape over it so it is a bit sketchy.

I also want to do Cap and rotor and maybe the spark plug wires. I have no idea what kind of Cap I need though. I like MSD and they have a nice set with a cap and rotor for a good price but it says HEI type. Does that mean I can't use it on my distributor?

HotRodPC · Jan 7, 2020

OK, so I'm skimming big time. I read the first page, not reading the other 5. I'd pull the distributor out and replace the whole unit in a complete drop in and go and be done. I'd lean toward the ICM too but it sounds alot like the coil too. Usually when ICM goes bad, it's bad and it never starts again. A coil can go bad, and run, then cool off and run again for awhile, then shut off again. Also got a magnetic pick up coil in the dizzy. Just replace the whole kit and kaboodle and your problem is solved. As old as the truck is, you're not wasting any money on replacing the dizzy with new bushings, shafts, coil, ICM, pick up, cap, rotor and all. It'll probably run better than you've ever had it run before.

Snoots · Jan 7, 2020

FOCUS DAMNIT. FOCUS!!!

Battery cables first. If they're questionable, replace them. Then go to the next thing.

legopnuematic · Jan 7, 2020

thecantaloupeman said:
Thanks! I'm definitely going to give this a look. I plan on replacing those battery cables. My negative cable is missing some insulation near the ground and has electrical tape over it so it is a bit sketchy.

I also want to do Cap and rotor and maybe the spark plug wires. I have no idea what kind of Cap I need though. I like MSD and they have a nice set with a cap and rotor for a good price but it says HEI type. Does that mean I can't use it on my distributor?

If you have an hei distributor then yes you can use the msd cap and rotor.

If you don't have hei and still have points, then you wouldn't have an ignition module in the dizzy and an external coil

The left one is points and the right is HEI

You must be registered for see images attach

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MisterB · Jan 7, 2020

legopnuematic said:
If you have an hei distributor then yes you can use the msd cap and rotor.

If you don't have hei and still have points, then you wouldn't have an ignition module in the dizzy and an external coil

The left one is points and the right is HEI
You must be registered for see images attach

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Nice of you to take the time to explain the difference, instead of being a dick by trying to shame him with the whole line "you don't know what HEI looks like!?!?"

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MisterB · Jan 7, 2020

Battery cables are cheap insurance. Just replace them. On an old truck, they are suspect anyway. You may need to put a 90 degree bend in the positive cable on the opposite end from the battery. The stock cable fits a little different than the aftermarket (even high quality) cables. If you don't do this, it'll likely short out intermittently. If you search my old posts, there's a thread on that with pictures.

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80BrownK10 · Jan 7, 2020

thecantaloupeman said:
Thanks! I'm definitely going to give this a look. I plan on replacing those battery cables. My negative cable is missing some insulation near the ground and has electrical tape over it so it is a bit sketchy.

I also want to do Cap and rotor and maybe the spark plug wires. I have no idea what kind of Cap I need though. I like MSD and they have a nice set with a cap and rotor for a good price but it says HEI type. Does that mean I can't use it on my distributor?

Cap an rotor depends on what distributor/ ignition system your running. HEI is the newer electronic ignition over the older points style ignition.

A ground cable does not really need any insulation really , it after all is ground. It is just extra security from a hot wire coming into contact with it and causing a short. But a ground wire can touch base metal anywhere along it's run and not matter, it after all terminates by being anchored to your frame or engine, in this case an alternator bracket. Your engine ground is a bare metal braided strap.

What to do...

80BrownK10

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thecantaloupeman

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80BrownK10

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talltidefan

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thecantaloupeman

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Snoots

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80BrownK10

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chengny

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thecantaloupeman

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HotRodPC

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Snoots

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legopnuematic

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MisterB

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80BrownK10

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