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Old 12-07-2012, 09:21 AM   #1
 
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Default Question about welding for the body guys..
I'm gonna try to weld in some new cab supports on my truck, still deciding whether to pull the cab off, or drop the gas tanks, and work underneath.

Would be easier to be able to roll the cab around to work on it, but I don't have help, it's just me, the truck is currently immobile, and I don't have an overhead crane, so I am thinking just dropping the tanks, jacking the body up in the air, and working on it that way.. Any ideas on how to easily lift a cab off by myself would be helpful tips too..

The big question I have is, I keep thinking about these cab mounting rails, they are welded in place, I will have to grind what is left of the old ones off, and place the new ones in their spot (another reason I like the idea of just lifting the cab straight up, is to be able to line these up as I am working) so, when I grind the old ones off, to bare metal, and place the new one in their spot, I am only really able to weld around the edges.. What do I do about the flat pieces in the middle that will essentially be bare metal sitting against each other? Every thing I think of doesn't seem like it will work to keep this from rusting between there! If I paint, the paint won't let me weld, if I scrape just the weld area, I end up melting the snot out of the paint, and it won't be protecting the metal.. I've thought about just using a ton of bolts, and painting between, then using body adhesive when I put it all together, all slathered in, and the combo of bolts and body adhesive should work to both keep rust out, and hold about as good as welding..

Is this a good idea? I know a lot of modern cars entire body parts are held in place just with the body adhesive alone! Let me know what y'all think of this.
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Old 12-07-2012, 09:59 AM   #2
 
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If you're welding all four sides you have eliminated both the moisture and oxygen at the contact point you're concerned about. You're overthinking this. Weld it, paint it, fugget about it.


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Old 12-07-2012, 12:44 PM   #3
 
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Originally Posted by skysurfer View Post
If you're welding all four sides you have eliminated both the moisture and oxygen at the contact point you're concerned about. You're overthinking this. Weld it, paint it, fugget about it.
You are assuming I am a good enough welder to completely close in all 4 sides!!!

There's some massive amounts of floor missing too, which will require me to add pieces, and weld them in, and I don't know if I can help (or even know if there are any!) that there may be some gaps.

I am using a 110v Gas MIG (I emphasised gas, because people will call a wirefeed flux core welder a MIG sometimes) and I think it can do the job, I am simply not confident in my own ability to completely close the box.

THis is what I am dealing with.

More pics in my album. I know most would write this truck off, and just get another. NO $$$ and I have the parts I think I need onhand to fix, so why not?

So you think welding will be easier than bolts and body adhesive?

Thanks for advice!
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:05 PM   #4
 
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Man, I dunno. You have what appears to be some major metal integrity issues there. Mig requires CLEAN metal, which you dont have much of. Even bolts and bonding will fail given that there's not much base material to work with. To be honest, that degree of rust is something that's way beyond my skill set.

Hey 89S, this one's for you!


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Old 12-07-2012, 01:22 PM   #5
 
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:23 PM   #6
 
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Originally Posted by skysurfer View Post
Man, I dunno. You have what appears to be some major metal integrity issues there. Mig requires CLEAN metal, which you dont have much of. Even bolts and bonding will fail given that there's not much base material to work with. To be honest, that degree of rust is something that's way beyond my skill set.

Hey 89S, this one's for you!
Yepper, need the Screw Gun and Self Tapper King in on this one I think. Not that it can't be fixed, but it's sure going to be a big piece and it appears the cab support is a bit rough too.


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Old 12-07-2012, 01:36 PM   #7
 
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That's what I am replacing, the cab supports, that's why I have to get the tanks out of the way, it goes all the way from the front to the back of the cab!

That's a long bead of weld, my welder isn't long enough duty cycle to do it, I wil have to put little spot welds all the way front to back on it, which was why I was thinking I may have trouble boxing it all the way in. Which was why I was thinking, maybe I should just use a bunch of bolts, rust treat the crap out of what is left after I grind the old cab supports out, and drill holes, botl the new ones in place with ample amounts of body adhesive to bond it as well.

The area where the cab support in front and in back are solid, I can bolt it there, I have new floor pans as well, I was just thinking that bolts may work better with body adhesive for this, being that it is so far gone!
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:40 PM   #8
 
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Originally Posted by skysurfer View Post
Hey 89S, this one's for you!
Originally Posted by HotRodPC View Post
Yepper, need the Screw Gun and Self Tapper King in on this one I think.
Jeeze, put that on my grave will ya??


You just jealous because I can take it back apart if I have to.


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Old 12-07-2012, 04:23 PM   #9
 
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Never seam weld patch panels, just spot weld every inch or so, alternating locations so you dont warp the steel. Then the body filler will seal the obvious places, and caulk/panel adhesive will seal the places underneath.


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Old 12-07-2012, 04:48 PM   #10
 
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i took my crew cab cab off the frame and stood it on the firewall to fix my center cab mounts
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Old 12-07-2012, 05:24 PM   #11
 
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You can lift the cab off by yourself if you strip the cab down to make it lighter. You can then use an engine crane buy securing chains to the seat mounting holes and lifting the cab up and pull it back with the crane. Having one or two extra people will make doing this job easier. One to help you pull on the cab and crane and the other to steady the cab.
Looking at those pictures you are better off replacing the rusted floor first and then marking the placement of the cab supports on the floor new metal. If you start cutting away at those cab mounts there is a good possibility that the cab is going to cave in or at least get tweaked causing the door not to shut or seal correctly.

You can use a product called weld thru primer and spray the weld area and that will control the rust. All that rusted stuff in those pictures needs to go, you will never get a good weld to anything rusted. If you try to weld to that stuff it just going to blow thru. Here is a good weld thru primer.http://www.walmart.com/ip/SEM-Paints...0000003260430.

GM never welded them solid so dill some small holes in the supports and plug weld them to the floor pan. Also drill some holes in the floor pan (once you line up the floor mount s so you can weld from the pan to the supports).

The she metal screws mention above will help hold things in place and once itís welded solid the remove the screws and weld up the holes.


In my humble opinion I would stat looking for a new cab.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:46 PM   #12
 
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Originally Posted by HotRodPC View Post
Wow, Meet the Flintstones and have a gay old time on that one.
That's what I was thinking...


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Old 12-08-2012, 08:54 AM   #13
 
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Is this your daily driver Christian?


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Old 12-11-2012, 11:07 AM   #14
 
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Originally Posted by 89Suburban View Post
Is this your daily driver Christian?
LOL no.. I bought it, drove it home, started looking at it further, and the more I dug into it, the worse it looked..

Looks like 2 feet of snow has now post poned any thoughts of working on this right now..

Honestly, from the outside, this truck didn't look this bad.

It was a family friend who needed money, and at the time I had $700..

Buying a cab will cost more than the whole truck, at least all of the prices I've found do around here. Also, this is usually for a cab with no title, and then I have VIN# issues, and I am the guy who the cops throw on the ground, and zip tie hands and feet if I spit out chewing gum and miss a trash can by inches in a no littering zone, so while a bunch of you all can get awya with it, the Gestapo will show up, knock my door over, fill my house with tear gas, probably shoot my wife and kids, and set fire to everything else I own if I were to ever consider tampering with a VIN plate on this truck.

So I see the recomendation is to put the replacement floor pans in first before cutting the supports? I would have thought it would be tweeked already, since if you look at the two mounts, they are actually broken in the middle!

Scared the crap out of me as I began taking this truck apart, I took the carpet up, and found some sheet metal held in with sheet metal screws, so I pulled them off to take a better look, and there I saw, this cab was basically held on with the fedners, and the rear mounts!!!
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Old 12-13-2012, 07:47 AM   #15
 
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Originally Posted by Christian Nelson View Post
Buying a cab will cost more than the whole truck, at least all of the prices I've found do around here. Also, this is usually for a cab with no title, and then I have VIN# issues, and I am the guy who the cops throw on the ground, and zip tie hands and feet if I spit out chewing gum and miss a trash can by inches in a no littering zone, so while a bunch of you all can get awya with it, the Gestapo will show up, knock my door over, fill my house with tear gas, probably shoot my wife and kids, and set fire to everything else I own if I were to ever consider tampering with a VIN plate on this truck.

So I see the recomendation is to put the replacement floor pans in first before cutting the supports? I would have thought it would be tweeked already, since if you look at the two mounts, they are actually broken in the middle!

Scared the crap out of me as I began taking this truck apart, I took the carpet up, and found some sheet metal held in with sheet metal screws, so I pulled them off to take a better look, and there I saw, this cab was basically held on with the fedners, and the rear mounts!!!
By the time you invest in all the replacement panels and time that is going to be needed to fix that cab you will be close to the prices of a replacement cab. Plus if you think the cab is already tweaked then that is one more reason to look for a replacement. If it is tweaked then none of your body panels will ever fit correctly.

I can understand about not wanting to buy a cab with no title. That is just a bad situation all round. My luck would be that I would finish the truck and the next day the local LEO would show up, impound the truck and haul my ass to jail.

Don't just look for a cab you can look for a complete truck or one without the drive train with a good cab and then sell the rest of the parts and make your money back and maybe make some extra cash to put back in the truck.

PS You can keep the snow.
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